Crush...Yiff...Destroy!

Michael Hirtes · Coadjutor Joined: 04 Aug 2003 Posts: 519

It had to happen sooner or later. "The Furry Empire Strikes Back":

http://www.livejournal.com/users/postvixen/437804.html#cutid1

The biggest hoot is when Rebecca Groat risks impaling her monitor with her growing nose, Pinnochio style, by saying:

http://www.livejournal.com/users/postvixen/437804.html?thread=4496940
"I've never heard Jim utter scorn for the poor."

Yeah right, Becky. Pull the other one. It plays Jingle Bells.

Rebecca (since I know that you are either reading this directly or had one of your suckups forward it over to you), let me tell you a little something about that loutish goofball you spread your legs for. I've heard Jim rag at people for being poor and on welfare (and what he'd wish he could do to them if he had his way) for years. I for one know first hand Jim's attitude towards the poor since Jim took that one time I told him I was on assistence (when I thought that Jim actually was a friend. Big stupid me! It never occured to me that Jim has no REAL friends. Just people he exploits) and he then shot his big hairy mouth off to anyone who would listen about it as a means to dehumanise me because of my situation (and why every shitclown on AFF now thinks they can win every argument against me just by screeching the word "welfare"). If THAT isn't proof that Jim has mocked people for being poor, I don't know what is.

That part where Rebecca said that Jim has scorn for liberals? Well, part of that scorn is because liberals seem to be the ones who support programs that provide assistance for the poor, which annoys Jim no end. Gee, that also sounds to me like a good sign of his "utter scorn for the poor", don't you think, Becky?

As for Jerry's art, since he isn't able to be on the net although he'd very much like to, THIS is his way to express his opinion in the best way he knows. Through his art, which he has been drawing LONG before Groat ever even heard of Rich Konkle. If anything, Jerry should be the one to know what a REAL furry is supposed to be since he's been there from the very beginning.

Oh, waitasec! He DID spell it out in that article he wrote long ago. I guess the furries can't read.

So yeah, when Jimbo finally falls on his pompous ass and has to contend with the kind of world Jerry & I have to deal with (and the kind of world Jim loves to ridicule), you'd BETTER expect us to enjoy a Biggie-Sized serving of schadenfreude in all this, 'cuz it's been a lonnnnnnnnng time coming.

Wayd Wolf · Coadjutor Joined: 06 Oct 2003 Posts: 456

FWIW Mike, we may or may not have differences regarding liberalism, which I detest, but when you have no choice but to go on assistance to live another day, it is a different matter.

I grew up in a housing project with my sister and divorced mother. Food stamps and welfare and that project kept us from living in a box or shack down by the CT river. What I hate liberalism for is the way it forces people time and time again to that situation and makes that an acceptable way of life versus helping with education, jobs, etc. which liberals don't do because self-sufficiency is anathema to their need to have people rely on them for everything.

You aren't the only person I've heard say this about Groat so if he is, he needs to put a sock in it because there's a difference between the liberals who promulgate and continue welfare state suffering and the people they take advantage of who are on welfare. No shame in accepting assistance when you have to Mike.

If anyone should be ashamed, it's the furries who go from room mate to room mate, from yiff pit to yiff pit, snarfing down everyone else's food and leeching off everyone else's income. When you have furries leaching off of other furries who work minimum wage part time job, you know something's truly fucked.

Michael Hirtes · Coadjutor Joined: 04 Aug 2003 Posts: 519

FWIW Mike, we may or may not have differences regarding liberalism, which I detest, but when you have no choice but to go on assistance to live another day, it is a different matter.

I grew up in a housing project with my sister and divorced mother. Food stamps and welfare and that project kept us from living in a box or shack down by the CT river. What I hate liberalism for is the way it forces people time and time again to that situation and makes that an acceptable way of life versus helping with education, jobs, etc. which liberals don't do because self-sufficiency is anathema to their need to have people rely on them for everything.

You aren't the only person I've heard say this about Groat so if he is, he needs to put a sock in it because there's a difference between the liberals who promulgate and continue welfare state suffering and the people they take advantage of who are on welfare. No shame in accepting assistance when you have to Mike.

If anyone should be ashamed, it's the furries who go from room mate to room mate, from yiff pit to yiff pit, snarfing down everyone else's food and leeching off everyone else's income. When you have furries leaching off of other furries who work minimum wage part time job, you know something's truly fucked.

Believe me Wayd. People don't go on assistance because they WANT to. It's because they HAVE to.

And let's face it, liberals seem to be a bit more likely to get into Heaven compared to conservatives in that department. Since when's the last time you ever heard Trent Lott actually wanting to EXPAND food stamps or public housing? IMO, the whole "faith based" scam is a massive GOP slap in the face to those who's cheeks are already beet-red, since it's the neocon assumption that people are poor not only because they are losers, but because they are dirty rotten heathens as well who need converting to the way of JAY-ZUSS (and don't think for a nonosecond that these slimes won't use at least some of that Federal cash for that purpose and just call it a "necessary tool for recovery").

As for my current state, I _refuse_ to bear any shame for it, because I never asked to be where I am now, so why should I be bearing any sort of remorse? The AFFholes try time and time again to dehumanise me for being disabled (I guess if my disability was for being addicted to fake fur & civet oil, they'd be more supportive. <g>), but since I didn't ask to be this way, why the fuck Hell should I let these jackoffs use it as a club against me?

If anything, they seem to be revealing a hidden sense of intense jealousy because they WISH they could get some of that cash too. Drives 'em batshit when I turn the tables on them.

Dogthing · Coadjutor Joined: 26 Oct 2003 Posts: 207

I am a conservative. I'm not too much of a republican though, and I'm definitely NOT the religeous type. My belief is that welfare is fine, if the people can take care of themselves, get themselves back on their feet.

I have no respect for people who can't find a way to better themselves. There's ALWAYS a way.

Anonymous · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 767

I am a conservative. I'm not too much of a republican though, and I'm definitely NOT the religeous type. My belief is that welfare is fine, if the people can take care of themselves, get themselves back on their feet.

I have no respect for people who can't find a way to better themselves. There's ALWAYS a way.

Not when you have to go out and earn money to feed your family,
And thus cannot even go to school to break the cycle of poverty

One mans spiffy trainers… is another mans sweated labour and passport to eternal poverty.

Wayd Wolf · Coadjutor Joined: 06 Oct 2003 Posts: 456

Believe me Wayd. People don't go on assistance because they WANT to. It's because they HAVE to.

Oh I'm fully aware of that. Been there.

And let's face it, liberals seem to be a bit more likely to get into Heaven compared to conservatives in that department. Since when's the last time you ever heard Trent Lott actually wanting to EXPAND food stamps or public housing?

I personally as a welfare survivor DO NOT want the system expanded. We have a world where like furry people are exhorted not to achieve, or even try. The last thing we should do is encourage people to think they'll have that to fall back on and not try so hard. I try VERY VERY HARD not to consider welfare and have passed up unemployment at times in order to force me to bust harder to get a job again.

Biggest problem is, as soon as you lose a job, there's a lefty offering you money that was confiscated from some rich or middle class person instead of left in their hands to pay me for an honest day's work. Every single tax increase has resulted in me taking longer to find a new job or get a new contract because the people with the money, don't have it any more. Every tax cut, people start buying and doing and next thing you know, there's hiring bonuses to be had on top of better contract payouts.

It's probably useless to argue it so I'll just state my opinion. What we need is less welfare and more education and jobs and where the Republicans fail is to live in a dreamworld that a government program won't get us a job. The government created this situation by catering to people wanting money from the treasury and now it needs to fix it and get people back in the habit of working. I know a LOT of furries who complain to me endlessly about not having a good paying job but refuse to do anything reasonable to get the job.

As for my current state, I _refuse_ to bear any shame for it, because I never asked to be where I am now, so why should I be bearing any sort of remorse? The AFFholes try time and time again to dehumanise me for being disabled (I guess if my disability was for being addicted to fake fur & civet oil, they'd be more supportive. <g>), but since I didn't ask to be this way, why the fuck Hell should I let these jackoffs use it as a club against me?

If anything, they seem to be revealing a hidden sense of intense jealousy because they WISH they could get some of that cash too. Drives 'em batshit when I turn the tables on them.

To some degree yes. Furries are notoriously lazy and stupid in that special way that inevitably causes them to do ten times more work avoiding something than they'd have done if they just faced the music in the first place. They'd even envy a disability.

My wife has asthma and epilepsy with severe depression and taken together that means some missed medication and some stress could bring about a pulmonary problem that kills her. So she cannot work. My mother-in-law has severe and worsening arthritis and will be forced out of work in two years, no more. I will be the only breadwinner in my house. So I do know what disabilities can be like and know that you're neither to be pitied nor envied but understood not to be in that situation by choice.

The assholes at a.f.f are seriously fucked up to make fun of you that way but not see any problem with the dipshits who aren't disabled and merely won't even try to save their own asses.

bobby · Rasophore Joined: 27 Oct 2003 Posts: 70

Whoah, reading that LJ I see a lot of names who don't post on AFF anymore. So let me get this straight. These people left AFF because they think it's a cesspool of flames and trolls, then migrate over to LJ where they proceed to make the same idiotic circular logic threads and take the same idiotic stances they did on AFF?

Personally, I don't think ex-dykes, pedophiles and guys who boink inflatable reindeer make great champions for furry fandom.

Banner's funny. "I am not a furry because I don't have fursuit sex and furry is people who have fursuit sex". I should see if I still have FurryMUCK logs containing him lying around.

Computolio · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 349

It had to happen sooner or later. "The Furry Empire Strikes Back":

http://www.livejournal.com/users/postvixen/437804.html#cutid1

Say what you will about Collins, but the point he's being used to illustrate is delusional on a scale not so widely seen anymore in furrydumb. Postvixen here is ACTALLY INSINUATING that the very process by which the furry scene deteriorated into a talentless jizzpool is improving it.

Also: Collins drew furry porn? REALLY YOU DON'T GAY I MEAN SAY

The only lesson I can take from this is that furry fandom's future must be really bright, because we're really good at making our nasty, bitter, boorish members leave.

FUCKING GOLD. Charla Trotman nust be reading this and laughing her ass off.

Michael Hirtes · Coadjutor Joined: 04 Aug 2003 Posts: 519

I personally as a welfare survivor DO NOT want the system expanded. We have a world where like furry people are exhorted not to achieve, or even try. The last thing we should do is encourage people to think they'll have that to fall back on and not try so hard. I try VERY VERY HARD not to consider welfare and have passed up unemployment at times in order to force me to bust harder to get a job again.

Biggest problem is, as soon as you lose a job, there's a lefty offering you money that was confiscated from some rich or middle class person instead of left in their hands to pay me for an honest day's work. Every single tax increase has resulted in me taking longer to find a new job or get a new contract because the people with the money, don't have it any more. Every tax cut, people start buying and doing and next thing you know, there's hiring bonuses to be had on top of better contract payouts.

Not to argue, but I know more than I have known anything before that if conservatives really DID get their way and abolished all welfare, I would literally not be alive today. I owe Tom Harkin (D- IA) my life, as far as I'm concerned. He actually came through for me at a time when I so desperately needed it. There were no republicans or conservatives in my times of crisis (well, there were a few, but they were the ones who had Groat-class contempt), and they would not have cared if I died in an alley somewhere. ("Well, best they better die then, and decrease the surplus population.", I guess is their POV).

If the price that I must pay is to be "dependent on the lefties", then so be it (Ich bin ein liberal, I guess). I remember those who have been kind to me, as well as remember those who hadn't.

mouse · Coadjutor Joined: 13 Jul 2003 Posts: 662

Whoah, reading that LJ I see a lot of names who don't post on AFF anymore. So let me get this straight. These people left AFF because they think it's a cesspool of flames and trolls, then migrate over to LJ where they proceed to make the same idiotic circular logic threads and take the same idiotic stances they did on AFF?

ok i thought i was just me , the logic in half those posts was unpenetrable

i tried reading several of the lengthy comments made by post vixen and was trying to figure out exactly what she (?) was argueing, what the point was, or just the plain idiocy missing an entire angle to something

DA · Coadjutor Joined: 06 Jun 2003 Posts: 320

Speaking of the Jerry Collins bunny boys portfolios. Someone's trying to sell a copy of them on furbid for the third time....

Re: welfare, I want a decent job, I suffer from Epilepsy, Dyslexia, Obsessive compulsive disorder and thanks to my school I have no qualifications...what choice do I have? Well I can get off my arse..mock up a portfolio as I am doing and bull my way into a job or I can spend the next 40 odd years just staring at four walls wondering what I'm doing with myself.

I agree with welfare for those who need it, it is not a crime to be on it anymore than it is a crime to never be out of work.

And I reckon in some cases Furry should be considered a mental diability...cos it certainly seems to fry some peoples brains :roll:

Anonymous · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 767

I can only say a couple of things in context to this.

If you're an artist, and thats your main source of income, sometimes
you will draw things you don't entirely agree with in order to make a living.

Jerry's art has deteriourated over time for certain, due to illness, lack of interest and the like. Its just the way it happens. Not everyone ages gracefully.

I was not a welfare child. my mother stayed home to raise me and my siblings, and my father worked a manual labor job for many years until he was able to get schooling, then he stayed in his field, public utilities, until as of now, he's been there for 25 years, head of the water and sewer divison for the city. My mother was college educated,in the field of education, and when we were all school aged, she went back to teaching. Yes, when i was younger we accepted some forms of assitence, but not welfare.

I am neither a conservative nor a liberal. I am liberatarian, and in my belief i feel that jim has become one over time.

Its odd to watch these "old dogs" of the fandom kick shit on each other. reminds me of school and the back-stabbing that seemed so prevalent there.

Blair · Rasophore Joined: 16 Jun 2003 Posts: 52

I can only say a couple of things in context to this.

If you're an artist, and thats your main source of income, sometimes
you will draw things you don't entirely agree with in order to make a living.

Jerry's art has deteriourated over time for certain, due to illness, lack of interest and the like. Its just the way it happens. Not everyone ages gracefully.

I was not a welfare child. my mother stayed home to raise me and my siblings, and my father worked a manual labor job for many years until he was able to get schooling, then he stayed in his field, public utilities, until as of now, he's been there for 25 years, head of the water and sewer divison for the city. My mother was college educated,in the field of education, and when we were all school aged, she went back to teaching. Yes, when i was younger we accepted some forms of assitence, but not welfare.

I am neither a conservative nor a liberal. I am liberatarian, and in my belief i feel that jim has become one over time.

Its odd to watch these "old dogs" of the fandom kick shit on each other. reminds me of school and the back-stabbing that seemed so prevalent there.

Michael Hirtes · Coadjutor Joined: 04 Aug 2003 Posts: 519

I am neither a conservative nor a liberal. I am liberatarian,

Oh, so you're a Frankenstein monster made from the worst parts of both conservatives and liberals then. If there's any party that loathes the poor more than the GOP, it's the Loonyterians.

The old Loonyterian mantra of "Abolish Social Security and toss Granny into the street, but let her have all the pot she wants." comes to mind. Sad thing is, with no money to get food or shelter (let alone medical care), pot is something granny couldn't obtain if those kind sweetheart Loonytarians make it legal or not.

Blair · Rasophore Joined: 16 Jun 2003 Posts: 52

I see. Right. So we're the LOONYtarians now?

I resent being related to either party. the whole idea of being in the middle
row is that the world is not black or white, but many shades of grey.

There are grey areas to so many things, and being hardcore one way or the other suggests a close-minded attitude.

If its not conservatives calling us "Fag-loving satanists and perversionists of conservative ideas, its liberals calling us Nazi-BabyKilling-Gun-touting-Hobags.

Just because i did not grow up in an enviroment where i needed public assistence doesnt mean i hate it. Welfare programs exist for the purpose of helping people who cannot help themselves. I hate the people who milk the system and refuse to do anything about their situation, but i will not damn those who try to make it better. Not every situation is escapable easily.

I have a hard time in believing in ANY hardcore political stance, but i do believe in one thing.

There are bigger problems in our world to worry about than pointless
fighting about political beliefs, and bashing mine because it just dosen't jive with your's is the mark of a immature and weak minded person.

Grow up.

Michael Hirtes · Coadjutor Joined: 04 Aug 2003 Posts: 519

I see. Right. So we're the LOONYtarians now?

I resent being related to either party. the whole idea of being in the middle
row is that the world is not black or white, but many shades of grey.

Libertarianism is no "middle ground" between liberal & conservative. It's just the worst elements from both parties, mashed together.

There are grey areas to so many things, and being hardcore one way or the other suggests a close-minded attitude.

If its not conservatives calling us "Fag-loving satanists and perversionists of conservative ideas, its liberals calling us Nazi-BabyKilling-Gun-touting-Hobags.

Just because i did not grow up in an enviroment where i needed public assistence doesnt mean i hate it. Welfare programs exist for the purpose of helping people who cannot help themselves. I hate the people who milk the system and refuse to do anything about their situation, but i will not damn those who try to make it better. Not every situation is escapable easily.

I have a hard time in believing in ANY hardcore political stance, but i do believe in one thing.

There are bigger problems in our world to worry about than pointless
fighting about political beliefs, and bashing mine because it just dosen't jive with your's is the mark of a immature and weak minded person.

Grow up.

I'm sorry if you feel that I was "bashing" your beliefs, but I have Zero Love for any political party that desires to destroy the ONE thing that is keeping me from a brutal freezing death in an alley somewhere. Until the Libertarian Party changes it's hostile stance towards federal assistence (as well as towards the people who are on it), my opinion about them stands firm.

Blair · Rasophore Joined: 16 Jun 2003 Posts: 52

Libertarianism is no "middle ground" between liberal & conservative. It's just the worst elements from both parties, mashed together.

I feel no real need to defend the party. If we were all like-minded to
to the extreme, it wouldn't be much of a middle ground.

And if your situation is so bad, why are you paying for an internet connection? Seems like it be a Frivolous purchase for someone close
to freezing to death, or is it a true necessity, like electricity?

Just an observation.

Michael Hirtes · Coadjutor Joined: 04 Aug 2003 Posts: 519

Libertarianism is no "middle ground" between liberal & conservative. It's just the worst elements from both parties, mashed together.

I feel no real need to defend the party. If we were all like-minded to
to the extreme, it wouldn't be much of a middle ground.

And if your situation is so bad, why are you paying for an internet connection? Seems like it be a Frivolous purchase for someone close
to freezing to death, or is it a true necessity, like electricity?

Just an observation.

Just what kind of stereotype do you have formed in that mind of your's?

Blair · Rasophore Joined: 16 Jun 2003 Posts: 52

Just what kind of stereotype do you have formed in that mind of your's?

One Im starting to enjoy. A little paranoid are we?

And as for forming a stereotype, i don't have to. Its already
there, tweaked to perfection. Stop reinforcing it.

You stereotype me, i stereotype you, and we all keep riding the same happy fun merry-go-round.

Michael Hirtes · Coadjutor Joined: 04 Aug 2003 Posts: 519

Just what kind of stereotype do you have formed in that mind of your's?

One Im starting to enjoy. A little paranoid are we?

And as for forming a stereotype, i don't have to. Its already
there, tweaked to perfection. Stop reinforcing it.

You stereotype me, i stereotype you, and we all keep riding the same happy fun merry-go-round.

Let's try to keep this from degenerating into AFF, ng'kay?

Mitch · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 290

Just what kind of stereotype do you have formed in that mind of your's?

One Im starting to enjoy. A little paranoid are we?

And as for forming a stereotype, i don't have to. Its already
there, tweaked to perfection. Stop reinforcing it.

You stereotype me, i stereotype you, and we all keep riding the same happy fun merry-go-round.

Let's try to keep this from degenerating into AFF, ng'kay?

PLEASE
Don't make me carry out my kitten-related threat. You won't like it... unless you like kittens....

Blair · Rasophore Joined: 16 Jun 2003 Posts: 52

I have no intention of letting this go any further. we disagree. thats it.

Mitch · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 290

It had to happen sooner or later. "The Furry Empire Strikes Back":

http://www.livejournal.com/users/postvixen/437804.html#cutid1

The biggest hoot is when Rebecca Groat risks impaling her monitor with her growing nose, Pinnochio style, by saying:

http://www.livejournal.com/users/postvixen/437804.html?thread=4496940
"I've never heard Jim utter scorn for the poor."

Yeah right, Becky. Pull the other one. It plays Jingle Bells.

I just noticed it made it to LJdrama. The comments are mildly amusing.