Crush...Yiff...Destroy!

mouse · Posted: 7/14/2003 4:32:16 AM Post subject: "Critterology" vs. "Phurries"

hi i just registered recently, ive looked through all the posts and the whole site. so im kind of responding to all of it at once and introducing myself at the same time, i apologize for the long post.

i really liked what jerry collins had to say in his article "Critterology" vs. "Phurries"
i always enjoy history

whether or not anythign will come of the revolution remains to be seen i guess, but the "critter greenwood" sure sounds nice to me

the gallery is really funny too [but gwar?!? cmon, i think furries would like that shit! big goofy costumes and the SEX-ECUTION-ER..SEXELLENT!! a band like agnostic front would have been a more brutal choice ! what with such classic tracks as victim in pain, fascist attitudes, and of course, the eliminator.. less funny to look at than the gwar punchline i guess huh?>

i am curious though as to who comprises the membership of this board/group. ive liked most of what ive read here and maybe its just me but i feel like im getting some mixed signals sometimes. it seems you guys bounce around from being some sort of cartoon fans to hating everything even remotely connected to furry or anytype of cartoon animal - with poe/sa-style hostility. im well aware those sites are supposed to be funny but personally i think thier boring, so im probably out of the loop with some of whats being posted. (there's also no way in hell i would ever pay for access to a message board)

first, a little about me. not that you should really be that interested, but just to give you an idea of where i'm coming from with whatever i write. i wouldnt consider myself a furry, although i share a few interests with them. i really consider myself a funny-animal fan. i've also always liked cartoons, when i was in high school i came across the NIMH and Redwall books and liked those too(btw - "mouse" is a real world nickname of mine and it came from shit like this. it is not a furry fandom name i use, or any thing like that, just in case you were curious). my family has always had computers and been on the internet since back into the early 80s with compuserve and Q-link. this is why for approximatly the past 10 years (im 22 now) i have always been vaguely aware of, and occassionally had brushes with the furry fans. one night near the end of dec 2002 i really got to taking in a lot of information on the fandom. i can barely remember why i started this, partly boredom and i think my younger brother (not a furry) was emptying a hard drive on to a new machine and i found probably a years worth of pawpets episodes he had downloaded (i remembered the year they were from because i clearly remembered being pissed off that he was tying up the phone line/computer with a 12 hour download every sunday for a stupid puppet show). i watched a few episodes thought it was kinda funny but way too long and i didn't get alot of the "furry" stuff they'd talk about. but it really got me curious about the fandom. the pawpets crew came across (to me) as being nerdy, but pretty cool people. so i started snooping around furry websites, boards , usenet etc. and all in all the only things i really ended up having any true interest in was the art site yerf, comicbooks (more on that later) a precious few webcomics, and a lot of reading ABOUT the fandom. i got most of my information from pressedfur, and all the shit that got started on flayrah and everywhere else (from the mag articles to mtv to shawn keller).
funny stuff - but basically i had come across a fandom that probably would have been really cool, that i probably would have been proud to be part of. however - it got fucked up, for whatever reason.

gay guys? theres nothing wrong with being gay, i dont give a shit. never have/never will

fursuits? i wouldnt ever really feel like dressing up but it could add a fun element

furries that look they were born in chyrnoble or 3 mile island? ...creepy, but i really do try to not to be superficial with people

i guess what bothered me the most is the fetishes. and all the fucked up artwork

and when you put all this together, and crank up the volume...it really makes my skin crawl

BUT
for the most part i avoided all of this. 7-8 months after i started and i have yet to *stumble* into any furry porn or anything that really would have driven me off completely. i DONT click the blurry thumbnail that looks "off" , i DONT follow the link...mainly just because i dont have to see. i dont want to. i dont get off on it - im not interested.

after a while (january '03) i ran across rabbit valley, had some extra cash id figured id see what "furry" comics were like. i mean after all comics are what the fandom is all about (guess i was wrong on that one, turns out comics is just a common denominator of furries. which IMO is ass-backwards) i hadn't bought a comic book in at least 10 years at this point. i just stayed in the g-pg13 sections and picked up some stuff that looked or sounded interesting.. i got sleepers and some other stuff, SSHHHH! by JASON. sleepers was alright, and i did like jasons book all the other stuff i ordered was out of stock. so i placed another order figuring that this is it, if there wasnt anythign amazing with what i picked up this time i would have just completely lost interest. i got both of kazalehs captain jack tpbs and bunch of clearance items including critters #9. Now im coming up to main point of this post: captain jack is probably the best comic/story i have ever read, or ever will read. i have almost everything mikes done at this point, critters was amazing and im coming close to having all 50 issues (i have the hardest to find issues already), all of space ark (funny how mitchrooney avoids furry like the plague), i even hunted down all the issues of ismet('81), which is probably gonna end up having been easier and cheaper than getting albedo #2. when i was reading punisher and aliens comics in 1990-1993 this stuff would have been off my radar completely. (coincidentally, after i became an admirer of kazalehs work, i was kinda surprised to find that i had his ren & stimpy comics for the past 10 years. being just a 12 year old ren and stimpy fan, i didnt know or care who drew (any of) my comics)
im slowly collecting furrlough when i find it cheap (its no critters). MOST of what i like is older stuff, so there is in a lot of ways, a very finite amount of books ill buy but there is still some really good comics going.
basically i feel some of these things are so good, they DO DESERVE a fandom

furry should have been a comic fandom and remained, almost exclusively, a comic fandom (some will claim it is, but i disagree)
why so much fucking roleplay?? why diapers ?? what the fuck does that have to do with anything...?!?

thus the main reason im pissed is that i truely do appreciate many published anthro works, it doesnt deserve a stigma. and it seems to me theres less good stuff today because less people are interested in doing it. and this is probably from all the fucked up people, behaviour, and bad press. and whats real good and has already been published, is gonna be tainted and wont get the respect it deserves and thats a goddamn shame...

what can be done to fix this though? (im assuming that you people want to do something , or have some kinda purpose )
changing names i dont think will cut it, seeing as how in technical terms it would -all- be anthropomorphic-animal fiction. . and furry is all that most furries have...so i cant really see them ever giving up, theyll fight to the last man i imagine

this discussions been had a million times, im getting deja-vu and losing direction with this so , im gonna end it here. does anyone here feel the same way i do ?

thanks for listening
-rob
mouse@blackvault.com

btw:
[http://www.angelfire.com/wi/aymp/index.html The Furry Critic
he does a fine job of trashing published furry smut, and promoting good comics>
this guy seems alright - i apprieciate what hes doing

Anonymous · Posted: 7/14/2003 4:50:00 AM Post subject: gwar

Leibling,the G.W.A.R. in my cartoon is the G.W.A.R. of it's own mythos,not the band!as to Agnostic front..look, theyr'e a damn good band,why put good ,honest,talented musicians in the hellish environs of a PHURRI-con?The guys in "A.F" don't deserve that!Maybe theSmiths or Human league or some other relic of the Reagan80s,BUT NOT AGNOSTIC FRONT!Whew! I mean JEEEZE! :lol: But thank you for the compliment on my article,I hope it was of some use to you in this nut house we call life!peace be,Jerry Collins...And remember;..."THE SPIRIT OF JOEY RAMONE IS WATCHING US!DON'T PISS OFF JOEY! :lol:

discojesus · Posted: 7/14/2003 5:25:31 AM Post subject:

Hey man, don't be talking shit about the Smiths. My favorite band of all time isn't just a relic of the 80s! It's...it's...uhm...alive in my heart? Whatever.

Hey there mouse. I came because I don't want to be laughed at, I stay because I think it's funny that I'm here.

I don't know what anyone would be doing watching the Funday PawPet show if they weren't furry. It's just a 4-hour sea of furry in-jokes and nerdyness.

I think you've also brought up a pretty good point that it's tough to find furry porn if you don't know where to look - it's not something easily stumbled onto. And yes, comics are good. w00t.

Anonymous · Posted: 7/14/2003 5:35:25 AM Post subject:

Brother DiscoJesus!The power of "BOB" compells me to appologise for the crack I made about the SMITHS :D (it seems theyr'e one of Connie Dobbs' favourites..SO QUIT HITTIN'ME WITH THAT 5WEDGE GOLF CLUB"BOB"!)but can we at least aggree that human league was terminally corny?If not,feh,who cares?I mean really? :wink: I better cool it with the emoticons(THEY"RE MAKING MY BRAIN HURT!!!)keep on the slack trail ya'll!(Jerry Collins)

The New Meat · Posted: 7/14/2003 8:32:31 AM Post subject:

I come here because I secretly want to have sex with beautiful dragyn/gryphyn men from outer space but I'm ashamed to admit it.

I agree, those are awesome pics in the gallery, Jerry. I'm still new enough to this whole sordid furry mess that I don't think I quite understood half of what was going on, but they're still neato keeno. So shine on, ya crazy diamond, and pay your respects to the sacred Dobbshead. Or something.

Reagen80s relic bands!? Next you'll be saying that Bananarama wasn't the greatest band of all time.

mouse · Posted: 7/14/2003 9:53:36 AM Post subject: Re: gwar

Leibling,the G.W.A.R. in my cartoon is the G.W.A.R. of it's own mythos,not the band!as to Agnostic front..look, theyr'e a damn good band,why put good ,honest,talented musicians in the hellish environs of a PHURRI-con?The guys in "A.F" don't deserve that!Maybe theSmiths or Human league or some other relic of the Reagan80s,BUT NOT AGNOSTIC FRONT!Whew! I mean JEEEZE! :lol: But thank you for the compliment on my article,I hope it was of some use to you in this nut house we call life!peace be,Jerry Collins...And remember;..."THE SPIRIT OF JOEY RAMONE IS WATCHING US!DON'T PISS OFF JOEY! :lol:

heh i hate sounding like an idiot twice, but i tell the truth i am unaware of any other gwar other than the band. what i was getting at was who agnostic front draws to thier shows. i think its also safe to say that for at least a little while the "hardest" music you could listen to would be agnostic front. a few years ago, a buddy of mine told me the business was playing, him and his sister were gonna go. i thought it was cool, then he told me a.f. , ensign and someone else was gonna be there. i wanted to see allt hese bands but i started worrying that im gonna wake up in the ER getting doc martins surgically removed from my asshole. unjustifiably (sort of, ive heard stuff), yet undeniably, a.f. draws nazis , and so does the business just for being an oi band. ensign, regular hardcore/punk , but they were on the anti racist action compilation so i figured the potential for opposing idealogical factions showing up was there. i told him if i go, im wearing regular cut jeans and a plain white t-shirt and im not talkin to anyone, id just hide in the bathroom until combat ceases then crawl out of the rubble and go home.
(i never ended up going because i couldnt get off work the show went fine, it wasnt that crazy either)
up until very recently i hadnt been to any hardcore/punk shows that didnt have at least 1-3 nazis showing up

Genghis · Posted: 7/14/2003 3:43:28 PM Post subject: Re: "Critterology" vs. "Phurries"

it seems you guys bounce around from being some sort of cartoon fans to hating everything even remotely connected to furry or anytype of cartoon animal - with poe/sa-style hostility.

Peronally, I just like cartoons - both reading and occasionally drawing them. The furries very rarely bother me in the slightest, as I don't exactly go out of my way to find them very often (apart from coming here and PoE, obviously).
Sometimes, however, they find me...

mouse · Posted: 7/14/2003 7:39:04 PM Post subject:

Hey there mouse. I came because I don't want to be laughed at, I stay because I think it's funny that I'm here..

thats cool, i wouldnt laugh at you

honestly, i could probably put up with a lot of furries, and im probably in the minority with most people here but i think maybe half of (am i being too optimistic?), or the silent majority are probably pretty normal. normal being a very relative term for me personally just because of the vast array of different people i hang out with in real life. look at it like this, ive been lurking for 3/4 of a year now, never said anything. i think theres a lot of "invisible furries" out there, that are intentionally keeping thier distance, kind of like i am.
the only 2-way communications ive had with furries is business transactions (comics on furbid, and online comic shops) and so far my opinion is that theyre damn friendly folk to deal with

I don't know what anyone would be doing watching the Funday PawPet show if they weren't furry. It's just a 4-hour sea of furry in-jokes and nerdyness.

im glad you brought that up, i figured that might cause some confusion(although the episodes i seen, they mainly listened to music, i remember them chasing an ice cream truck down. a friend called em from jail. i just thought it was all just really weird, and furry only came up once in a while. like i said i cant sit thru a 4 hour show so i jsut would for example watch an hour, then skim the rest on a few of em, im sure i missed alot)

its a weird occurence, but i cant tell you for a fact, there are honest-to-god non-furries who read furry stuff. the only reason my brother used to watch the show is because my cousin (USAF) told him about it. he is also not a furry, but i know he reads alot and reads furry science fiction sometimes ( i think in general he likes sci fi, and military / history shit).
there was a huge book , must have been like 600 printed pages (i didnt read this one), floating around my house its probably still here somewhere. he had mailed that to my brother, and i know MY MOM read it and liked it also, and that it had human-animal characters. there was also a much shorter story, something about Gnade street (i dunno if you know what im talkign about?), i cant rememebr much of it, this was liek3-4 years ago now , but he also sent that one to my brother my mom and i also ended up reading it - now im assuming these were fanfictions (or just stories, fanfiction might be the wrong word) of some sort written by furries.
all "mom" jokes aside, she would NOT have liked these if they were fucked up porn or any other kind of off the wall shit. i can also tell you that im sure that she doesnt know or care what a "furry" is. my brother probably just gave her the book and said something like "here, this is a good story"
they were genuinely well written amateur sci fi
and i think its reasonable to say that this is probably not the first case like that in the country

if the writings good then theres really nothign to make fun of
sci-fi by definition can usually be about anything, it must take an amazing amount of effort to pull off sci-fi taht comes across as weird you know what im saying?
with furry DEFINATLY being a sub-division of just general science fiction, the ONLY reason its not accepted by gen sci fi community or just casual science fiction readers is because of outrageous (lewd) , selfish (fetish), and childish ("dont judge me!") behaviour on the part of the furries
in other words, i think a lot of general sci - fi readers coudl read and enjoy furry works (good ones), just so long as they dont realize "what thier getting into"

reputations a bitch

Anonymous · Posted: 7/15/2003 5:09:38 AM Post subject: Aiiieee!

it just keeps gettin' scarier gang! :shock: I want to defect to another planet! :( later on good people!

Anonymous · Posted: 7/16/2003 4:55:08 AM Post subject: Days gone by

Mouse's story reminded me of a place we used to have here in Atlanta called the"Metroplex" a great mosh pit,and funky slack vibes..until the nazi skinheads fouled it up!it later went toes up,caught fire when some poor homeless guys were trying not to freeze to death!became a parking lot..a lot great bands played there!C.O.C.,Agnostic front,the cramps,to name a few..and now,just old dreams and concrete dust...so it goes.(Jer)