Crush...Yiff...Destroy!

m_estrugo · Coadjutor Joined: 13 Nov 2003 Posts: 160

http://www.thestranger.com/current/city.html

Student Bloggers Reveal Back Story of Newport High Lockdown
by Amy Jenniges

On Tuesday, March 23, Bellevue's Newport High School went into lockdown during the first lunch period, when a sophomore was spotted in the hallway near the library holding a gun to his own head.
(...)
The 16-year-old student--who was immediately expelled and arrested for bringing a gun onto school grounds--remained essentially anonymous.
(...)
After school, dozens of students logged on to their Internet diaries and wrote about the incident in teenage shorthand, sharing the student's name, and their thoughts about the lockdown.
(...)
According to their accounts, the student who brought the gun to Newport was being harassed at school, possibly for being gay.
(..)
... the kid who brought the gun was a loner who liked to wear black and chains and stuff like cat ears.
(...)
Why were students giving the 16-year-old boy a hard time? Besides accounts of a unique personality--"He has pink highlights in his hair and always wore black trench coats," one student wrote, and another reported, "He had a tail (a fake tail). I KNOW HIM!! in my bio class"

Dogthing · Coadjutor Joined: 26 Oct 2003 Posts: 207

stupid fag

mouse · Coadjutor Joined: 13 Jul 2003 Posts: 662

Why were students giving the 16-year-old boy a hard time? Besides accounts of a unique personality--"He has pink highlights in his hair and always wore black trench coats," one student wrote, and another reported, "He had a tail (a fake tail). I KNOW HIM!! in my bio class"

Im sure there will be more stories like this as time goes on.

Seriously the best advice I could give this kid would be - fuck high school. He's 16. He should drop out now since he's already been expelled. He's probably smart enough to ace the GED without even studying. The test is at like a ninth grade level. From there you can get into a community school no problem. Enter any 2 year degree program and get good grades and be off to any real school he would want to go to all by the age of 18 or 19.

If there is anything I've learned is that high school education is completely worthless.

(I was expelled from high school TWICE 2 consecutive years. My stupidity was going back the first time.)

Kadius · Coadjutor Joined: 10 Feb 2004 Posts: 147

Gah.. I'm sure everyone hated highschool. Or so I'd hope. But bringing a gun to school because people bother you is a bit too much. But it might be more understandable if the faculty literally ignored him when he complained about being picked on or just plain looked away. That happens and I saw it happen in my old school. But some people forget, this isn't the time they grew up in. Guns are easier to aquire. And, dare I say; people are more inclined to use them. But the real thing is, people still aren't interviening when their oh-so precious football players pester certain kids day in and day out. That's just begging for incidents like this to happen.

Though, it sounds to me like he was (in a way) drawing attention to himself by dressing like he did. Intentionally or not. High school is all about being sheep and doing what everyone else is doing, wearing what they're wearing. God forbid there be a black sheep who does his/her own thing. I myself was picked on for being differant in school. From 5th grade on, so I know a bit of what it's like to have this kind of thing happen. (But don't we all?) And there were times... well, let's say I just didn't feel like putting up with it any more.

This is literally what I heard two 'rednecks' say about a sophmore my last year of school.

"You see that guy over there?"
"Yeah"
"He's a fag"
"I know"
"He needs to die"
"I fuckin' hate him, I hope he gets aids and dies"

Woah, ho-lee-shit. I knew the guy they were talking about and he's alright. But wishing he'd die because he's gay? We've got a long way to go.

(Oh, and by the way. That 'angst' picture just screams wanna-be-goth-everybody-hates-me,I-read-JTHM-and-listen-to-NIN-and-CradleOfFilth- cause-they're-sooooo-goth-and-everyone-else-does.)

Wayd Wolf · Coadjutor Joined: 06 Oct 2003 Posts: 456

When I was young, we expressed our angst by getting laid at fourteen with our thirteen year old girlfriend on the dining room table after getting drunk on our parents' rec room bar stock(Kaluha, Beefeaters and Jack Daniels in a milk glass), and high on their stash(Peruvian flake and So-Cal weed) and then barfing all over her dress so she had to walk home topless with a towel wrapped around her while we played Atari Asteroids for the nine billionth time.. Now they put guns to their heads and wear tails. Yeesh, but things have gotten worse, if minimalist.

viron · Apocrisiary Joined: 04 Mar 2004 Posts: 49

sounds like your standard angsty furry teenager to me. although he could just be another anime fanboy, as teenaged anime fanboys.. er mostly anime fangirls actually, wear cat ears even in public, like at the mall and such.

but the wild attention whoring in that manner, that's classic furry youngster. wouldnt surprise me in the slightest if he was.

Wayd Wolf · Coadjutor Joined: 06 Oct 2003 Posts: 456

sounds like your standard angsty furry teenager to me. although he could just be another anime fanboy, as teenaged anime fanboys.. er mostly anime fangirls actually, wear cat ears even in public, like at the mall and such.

but the wild attention whoring in that manner, that's classic furry youngster. wouldnt surprise me in the slightest if he was.

Yup, and people tell me the cretins at a.f.f are the exception, not the rule. More like symptomatic of an increasing infection known as furry loserdom.

ZenZhu · Coadjutor Joined: 22 Mar 2004 Posts: 475

It seems more and more teens are getting sucked in by furry fandom. That's the main thing I've often been concerned about with not just the nudie stuff in furry, but the truly depraved fetishism being so easy to come by. Maybe my concern is misplaced, but it seems that the nature furrydom today makes it a ripe opportunity for folks waiting in the wings, ready to prey on these young newcomers. I know that the net in general has become this way.... but do they really need to make it so easy for minors to be assaulted with images of multi-schlonged skunk hermtaurs?

As the influx of youth slowly takes over furry, and the original cast of Furry Night Live dies, leaves the fandom, gets incarcerted, or whatever, it kind of seems like furry is getting absorbed by a mix of goth and raver culture. Maybe years from now, furry will just be a word on some kids neon rainbow t-shirt as they do some Extacy in their fake ears and tail.

"Shyeah... my grandpa did that crap about 'misplaced animal spirits' and tried to tell me it was 'furry.' As if.... the old fart has no clue what furry really is. Hey, did you see Jenna's new blue-glow ears and that glow-stick tail? She's furryfine."

"No kidding. My mom still watches a video tape.. can you believe it.. a video tape of the Lion King almost every night. She has, like, 10 copies of it in case she wears one out. And she tries to tell me that's furry? Puh-leeze.. like a talking lion has anything to do with furry. She's snorting pixie-sticks or something... as if Disney was ever anything other than a goverment defense contractor."

"Wanna go snort some gold paint?"

"That's so furry.. I'm there, d00d."

Donotsue · Coadjutor Joined: 17 Jan 2004 Posts: 106

Whass wrong with video tapes? All DVDs I have bite in some unique ways...

Fresh from the package Terminator 2 extras refused to work at all on my brand new comp...

Phooey on the hi-tech!

Can't even tape anything from TV nowdays when their lousy systems can't play a movie without digi-flaws..

I want 8mm film back! =)

ZenZhu · Coadjutor Joined: 22 Mar 2004 Posts: 475

The idea was some li'l punked-out raver thing rolling their eyes at video tapes, which'll be like the 8-tracks of the future by the time "furry" becomes little more than raver fashion. By then, movies will come hidden in Chiklets or something.

mouse · Coadjutor Joined: 13 Jul 2003 Posts: 662

No, VHS Cassettes actually did suck. I've never like tape media, other than reel to reel. If it was Beta instead of VHS things would be different since Beta was vastly superior in almost every imaginable way. Just goes to show you its not always the best product that becomes the standard .

Wayd Wolf · Coadjutor Joined: 06 Oct 2003 Posts: 456

No, VHS Cassettes actually did suck. I've never like tape media, other than reel to reel. If it was Beta instead of VHS things would be different since Beta was vastly superior in almost every imaginable way. Just goes to show you its not always the best product that becomes the standard .

What, you're still screwing around with that crap? Doesn't anyone have a PVR yet?

Me, I'm building one using an MPEG-4 encoder. Definitely DOESN'T suck.

Donotsue · Coadjutor Joined: 17 Jan 2004 Posts: 106

But the old cartoons and stuff put out on DVD is sometimes badly packed.. hastily "restored" or even censored ...

I got me a huge collection of cartoons from england mid 90s.. I can't replace them yet... They'll serve me well for another 10 years.. I don't
even watch them all that often... nowdays. =)
They're not in shabby cardboard boxes either..=)

And it seems euro VHS tapes hold more than US ones... even 4 hours on normal speed...

Sure.. the DVDs I now have and which work like charm I like! =)
But if I see sumfin reasonably bad... let's say Inspector Gadget2 VHS on a cheapo bin for a Jewro.. sure I'll buy THAT and not the DVD for a fiver. =)

I'm old! What do ya expect.. I still own some vinyls.. =)

*cheap cheap cheap*

ZenZhu · Coadjutor Joined: 22 Mar 2004 Posts: 475

I dunno about overseas, but collections of old cartoons in general in the states are pretty bad, regardless if they're on tape or DVD. They're mashed together with low production values with the idea that a lot of money needn't be spent on something that's little more than an electronic babysitter. You'll probably never see a DVD of classic WB wartime cartoons here in the US... that's just not PC. It's too bad. I wouldn't mind a collection of unedited early Tom & Jerry cartoons.. before those three psychadelic ones and before Chuck Jones mangled them.

Shmorky · Coadjutor Joined: 22 Nov 2003 Posts: 182

waaah, people don't like me!

Hey, school is hard for everyone. Try having some redneck asshole threaten he's going to rip off your fingers and stab you to death if you even look at him funny, then put a knife really close to your face just to show you he's not kidding.

ZenZhu · Coadjutor Joined: 22 Mar 2004 Posts: 475

I was never a popular kid. Hell, the thing that saved me from being THE class nerd was probably that there was someone even nerdier than me. But I was just being myself.. a nerd in jeans and a t-shirt. No gangsta clothes, no pancake makeup, no fake tail... So I'm not popular.. big freakin' deal. So, what I don't get is these goth kids and such that go out of their way to be pegged as outcasts, and then bitch and moan about how they're outcasts. I came to theorize long ago.. even when in high school... that kids watch TV and movies and think their adolescent years are not complete without angst and anguish and all sorts of trials and tribulations that would make a movie of the week.

Heaven forbid you be cursed to have a normal childhood/young adulthood. If there's not something wrong with you, then, there's something wrong with you.

I think the biggest laugh I got in this vein was a guy on an MTV show called Fanatic.. where hardcore fans of musicians would get to meet them. They had one guy that was really into Marylin Manson... so much that he dressed like him and even wore the SFX contact lenses. So, this loser has the clueless gall to look at the camera and say how people persecute him for just being true to himself.

You are copying somebody right down to what you wear on your freakin' eyeballs. How is that being "true to yourself???????" All you've done is taken someone else's identity, used it to fill the void in your glaring lack of identity, and convinced yourself that it's the real you.

Dogthing · Coadjutor Joined: 26 Oct 2003 Posts: 207

In the first half of high school, I was generally unpopular. Mostly because I had a bad sense of style, didn't really care how I looked, didn't care what other people thought of me, and didn't care if I had friends or not.

The second half was much different, because I finally began to write for the school newspaper. I'm big into reading, as I'm sure many of us are, and down here (Royal Palm), that's uncommon. I won a spot as a columnist, and began taking THE SCHOOL BY STORM!!!1

I wrote generally non-sensical, wacky, and funny "exposēs" on non-issues, such as inter-school candy sales, 'administration funded' 'terrorism' (the tardy policy), and crap like that. A lot of my humor style came from the SA forums. Everyone loved them, and I became recognized as one of the school's funny guys.

Over that year, I realized that as more and more people came to know me, and I was making more and more friends, I should probably begin caring about how I look and smell. I became a fairly well-dressed kid. I got more frequent haircuts. I began working out (well, this year).

This year, at my prom, I was able to shake hands and have pictures taken with a good majority of the more noticable people in my school. For me, it was a pretty big jump from a weird little fat kid to an outspoken comic and intellectual (lol).

I'd have to say that I'm pretty happy right now. :)

Rusty · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 82

I was never popular in high school either, I was the nobody that no one knew or likley wanted to know. I was the guy people spread all sorts of rumors about. I was made fun of in the first couple of years, but durring the last few people finally grew up and were content either to let me be or talk to me like a real person (before any comments about the five years of HS thing, where I come from, up until a few years or so after I left, it was normally five years. They've cut it down to four now though).

I never really had any friends, and I was the kind of guy that who, if I had a friend get into something (something constructive, I would never do drugs or smoke etc) extra ciricular, I would prolly be willing to try it out as well. But, since I didn't have friends, I didn't.

If anything, the teens of today are *very* lucky to have the web and access to all of the support it offers. Although, I do have to admit that the kind of support they're getting has a bad habit of being the bad kind that encourages them to do things they really shoulden't be doing.

But, it can also be an invaluable source of information and the good kind of support like 'don't worry about being a nobody that is ignored, there are loads of people out there that are the same and that most people find HS depressing and a time of their life best forgotten so not to worry about it.

Bottom line is, I'm sure we all have sob stories about how hard our lives were in HS and about all the things that 'everyone but me' got to do and experience. Believe me, I have plently. But a lot of people also need to put it into perspective, I mean, I see people whining about their lives that are living what for me would be a dream life (just like for me to put it into perpective, I'm sure a lot of people would kill to have my life, and other would kill to have theirs and so forth), it's all in how you look at it. I have found it amazing how putting things into perspective can help a lot to fight the HS 'my life sucks' depression a lot of people fall into.

mouse · Coadjutor Joined: 13 Jul 2003 Posts: 662

I was never a popular kid. Hell, the thing that saved me from being THE class nerd was probably that there was someone even nerdier than me. But I was just being myself.. a nerd in jeans and a t-shirt. No gangsta clothes, no pancake makeup, no fake tail... So I'm not popular.. big freakin' deal. So, what I don't get is these goth kids and such that go out of their way to be pegged as outcasts, and then bitch and moan about how they're outcasts. I came to theorize long ago.. even when in high school... that kids watch TV and movies and think their adolescent years are not complete without angst and anguish and all sorts of trials and tribulations that would make a movie of the week.

Oh whatever.

Sorry, A lot of people have no choice in whether they are outcasts or not. I doubt those goth kids that 'chose' to be outcasts were loved by everyone before they decided to dress and act like they do. Get a clue.

And even more to the point. Where are getting this idea about how people dress? Some of them are copying others..but how could you ever even determine that? Everyone should just wear t-shirts and jeans, or whatever the big style is at the time? Thats a bunch of BS.

At my school it was the preppy looking jocks that all wore Tommy Hilfiger and other designer clothes that ran the school. Kids in t-shirts and jeans, ripped/dirty clothes, were the 'scumbags' everyone hated. I didnt matter if you wore all black/gothic and jewelery, paramilitary clothes or even just dressed plainly. I don't know where you guys are from, its not liek I was living in the ghetto, Im out in the suburbs and when I was in school I seen a lot of people getting the shit kicked out them. I not talking about just shoving each other around and throwing punches. I knew several people who were hospitalized, and several incidents involving guns being pulled (outside of school and school hours).

viron · Apocrisiary Joined: 04 Mar 2004 Posts: 49

Bottom line is, I'm sure we all have sob stories about how hard our lives were in HS and about all the things that 'everyone but me' got to do and experience. Believe me, I have plently. But a lot of people also need to put it into perspective, I mean, I see people whining about their lives that are living what for me would be a dream life (just like for me to put it into perpective, I'm sure a lot of people would kill to have my life, and other would kill to have theirs and so forth), it's all in how you look at it. I have found it amazing how putting things into perspective can help a lot to fight the HS 'my life sucks' depression a lot of people fall into.

But kids that age can't put things into perspective. it isn't until they leave home and grow up do they ever understand. that's why they commit suicide all the time, to them the school community is the entire world.

and try to explain that to a depressed kid. don't worry, things will get better, put things into perspective... no, kids won't listen to that even though its true.

sometimes i wish i could tell all the kids i run into about what i've learned as a much older adult, but i never do. I know it's almost futile to reason with a young person of that mindset. at least there are kids that are more worldly who understand that this thinking is a dead end.

it's laughable in a way when you see kids write their angst on the net, but at the same time it really is a problem because to them it's perceived as way worse.

ZenZhu · Coadjutor Joined: 22 Mar 2004 Posts: 475

Since I've started here, you've had a real talent for misconstruing just about everything I type. I hadn't really bothered to address it, since the difference of views wasn't important enough to respond to the baiting. But, just to address it once for the record on where we have and will differ in our views, I think the easiest thing is just to borrow from your post:

Oh, whatever.

'nuff said.

mouse · Coadjutor Joined: 13 Jul 2003 Posts: 662

Since I've started here, you've had a real talent for misconstruing just about everything I type.

Riiiight

It seems you are the one with a talent - for backwards logic and jumping to easiest conclusions constantly.

ZenZhu · Coadjutor Joined: 22 Mar 2004 Posts: 475

I don't wanna turn this into a big bruhaha, so I'll just leave it at the following then let you have at it without another peep from me on the subject of our differences:

M-kay.

mouse · Coadjutor Joined: 13 Jul 2003 Posts: 662

All I have ever done is respond to messages that show up on this forum. You have made a lot of posts recently ...where do you get that I am somehow targetting you?

ZenZhu · Coadjutor Joined: 22 Mar 2004 Posts: 475

But, it can also be an invaluable source of information and the good kind of support like 'don't worry about being a nobody that is ignored, there are loads of people out there that are the same and that most people find HS depressing and a time of their life best forgotten so not to worry about it.

What's interesting is to watch the evolution of people after high school. The "nerds" and "unpopular" kids often hit their stride around college, when more emphasis is placed on personal pursuit of skills/knowledge/etc. That seems to be when the "nerds" really come into their own.

Some of the "popular" kids, however, seem to stop evolving shortly after high school. Without the heirarchy of popular>semi-popular>unpopular that they've relied on for several years to provide them with a sense of purpose, many of them flounder. A lot of them eventually come around, but I think the "unpopular" kids, if they don't get stuck wallowing in self-pity, have an easier time quickly adapting to the world outside of high school.

It's always fun to visit my home town and realize that the person taking my order at Wendy's used to be the star quarterback, or the girl ringing me up at the grocery store was the homecoming queen. I think the biggest shock was going to Burger King once about a year after high school, having one of the school bullies taking my order, AND his girlfriend showing up with their 2 infants. :shock: There was also learning my arch-nemesis throughout grade school had died of a drug overdose.

Rusty · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 82

What's interesting is to watch the evolution of people after high school. The "nerds" and "unpopular" kids often hit their stride around college, when more emphasis is placed on personal pursuit of skills/knowledge/etc. That seems to be when the "nerds" really come into their own.

This was certainlly true for me. In college, I suddenly had friends and was hanging out with people. Suddenly I could be myself. It was really nice.

A lot of them eventually come around, but I think the "unpopular" kids, if they don't get stuck wallowing in self-pity, have an easier time quickly adapting to the world outside of high school.

I think that's because their used to be on their own and not depending on others apporoval for things. So, they are better able to make it on their own and do things they feel are right because they arn't waiting for someone to say it's okay. But, I'm not an expert on human behavior, so I really don't know for sure.

ZenZhu · Coadjutor Joined: 22 Mar 2004 Posts: 475

This was certainlly true for me. In college, I suddenly had friends and was hanging out with people. Suddenly I could be myself. It was really nice.

Maybe some of this is because.. and this is just theory here... high school breeds conformism. Not only do you have teachers that can't teach without a master copy of the textbooks, so they promote conformism to obscure their ignorance, but you have a bunch of kids coming from a very similar area. College, on the other hand, is often innately diverse.. with people of all ages and backgrounds coming not only from all over the country, but all over the world in some cases.

I think that's because their used to be on their own and not depending on others apporoval for things. So, they are better able to make it on their own and do things they feel are right because they arn't waiting for someone to say it's okay. But, I'm not an expert on human behavior, so I really don't know for sure.

I think that does hold true in a lot of cases. In high school, there's a certain level at which you're expected to perform.. and anything beyond that often challenges the teachers, so even they try to keep the drive to excel to a minimum.. except for the truly good teachers, maybe. In college, however, it's often more about simply producing results.... if you produce the expected results by unconventional means (as long as you didn't do something wrong and just get the answers by accident), great. If you went above and beyond the call of duty, so much the better. Obviously, you have to live up to academic standards.. but in college, I think there's more emphasis on living up to your own standards. The "outcasts" have been used to providing their own sense of self, self-worth, standards, and purpose. So, in college, they're already equipped with that... whereas the "popular" folks are finding it to be their first time really being their on their own.. not just away from home, but socially as well. There's cliques in college, of course, but they don't quite rule the roost like in high school.

viron · Apocrisiary Joined: 04 Mar 2004 Posts: 49

Obviously, you have to live up to academic standards.. but in college, I think there's more emphasis on living up to your own standards. The "outcasts" have been used to providing their own sense of self, self-worth, standards, and purpose. So, in college, they're already equipped with that... whereas the "popular" folks are finding it to be their first time really being their on their own.. not just away from home, but socially as well. There's cliques in college, of course, but they don't quite rule the roost like in high school.

veyr interesting suggestion there, i'm impressed. to add to that, i believe simply the 'freedom' factor contributes to the college experience. Notice that secluded or special colleges where everyone live together breed more high schoolish behaviors from the students, whereas ones that are convenient to the 'real' world and students from all over who drive in or whatever, those ones are more like real world environments. in those cases, i believe the former outcasts really do well because it's just a huge reinventing of their lives in a world where everyone around you doesn't care what you're up to and you're free to go anywhere and do anything you want. it's just easier to relax, be yourself, and perform.

although i find it interesting people who were popular in college do end up somehow getting lost in the sea, not so popular anymore. You have this gigantic college where basically anyone can do anything and no one has the same classes and stuff. either they fade into mediocrity or something else happens. i knew some popular HS kids who went nuts.

to their credit, some popular HS kids use their skills they used in HS, such as persuasion and other social skills they used to climb the ladder or otherwise get popular, to succeed in college. you just never hear much of them because what's one successful college kid out of the thousands of students who are all more worried about who to fuck or where to drink that night.

Rusty · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 82

Just remember that not everyone goes away to college nor does everyone go to a four year college.

I didn't go away to college and I went to a two year college (coulden't afford to 'go away' nor could I afford a degree program, which is fine as such a program wasen't 'for me' as I was never accademically inclined)

Once I did get to college, I started meeting people of all ages and diffrent walks of life and personality types and it really helped to give me perspective. Maybe it's because it was a two year college, so a good percentage of the students were older and more mature etc, and I've found that being arround more mature people tends to have a 'rubbing off on you' type of effect, well on me at least.

There were some people from HS there of course, but I found that they acted much more mature and nicer then in high school. It was weird, it was like people could finally as they wanted to act and think independantly rather then conforming to 'the way everyone thinks'.

I think that does hold true in a lot of cases. In high school, there's a certain level at which you're expected to perform.. and anything beyond that often challenges the teachers, so even they try to keep the drive to excel to a minimum.. except for the truly good teachers, maybe.

Oh boy can I relate to that. My HS basically taught us to coast through life never going beyond the bare minimal effort and to be happy with mediocre grades. Only my best teachers tried to get us to strive for better.

What's interesting is how that mentality is seem in some work places where you have situation where an employee that showed ability and took initiative and showed independant thought ends up fired.

ZenZhu · Coadjutor Joined: 22 Mar 2004 Posts: 475

Maybe it's because it was a two year college, so a good percentage of the students were older and more mature etc, and I've found that being arround more mature people tends to have a 'rubbing off on you' type of effect, well on me at least.

I think that does hold true in a lot of cases. In high school, there's a certain level at which you're expected to perform.. and anything beyond that often challenges the teachers, so even they try to keep the drive to excel to a minimum.. except for the truly good teachers, maybe.

Oh boy can I relate to that. My HS basically taught us to coast through life never going beyond the bare minimal effort and to be happy with mediocre grades. Only my best teachers tried to get us to strive for better.

What's interesting is how that mentality is seem in some work places where you have situation where an employee that showed ability and took initiative and showed independant thought ends up fired.

I started at a local junior college, then moved on to a 4-year, and then graduate school. I think a junior college is a great place to start off, especially if you don't know what you're going to do. It also is some place where you come across more older students... so you have people straight out of college all the way up to retired seniors just doing stuff for fun. I think this mingling helps you learn to deal with people of all walks, rather than just your chronological peers. I'm guessing everyone here doesn't really have many "peers" of the same age, as I have always felt.

I was witness first-hand to some of the steady decline of the quality of grade-school and high school teachers. I tought basic geology laboratory during my graduate school years. Almost 50% of any class was education majors looking to go into teaching grade or high school. And they were always the ones to bitch first about "Is this gonna be on the test??" "Why do I have to know what minerals these are? I'm never gonna use this!!!!"

Uhm... gee.... if you're going to be teaching kids... which may include "earth science," don't you think paying a little more attention in your own classes might be beneficial? But the future teachers were always the ones with the worst learning ethic. Call me crazy, but my family... who were mostly teachers... raised me with the idea that the more you know about anything, the better off you are.. and that learning never stops.

Then, when you ask these people why in hell they want to be teachers, they say, "Oh, because I love kids."

Well.. marry a doctor or a lawyer and pop out a few of your own. Don't condemn the rest of the population's children to suffer for your own ignorance by insisting on passing it on. :evil:

Rusty · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 82

I've always resented the term junior college, it seems considening, just like I resent it when people refer to a four year college as a 'real' college.

The program I took has a two year diploma; it wasen't one of these 'first two years of a degree' deals.

I didn't go to a four year college (university up here as we really don't have four year colleges) because what I wanted to take was something best learned hands on. I was always told that college programs were hands on, about 75% hands on and 25% theory and was more results oriented and a heck of a lot less expensive then Uni. I don't leartn by going over manuals, I learn by doing, making mistakes, learning what I did wrong so I don't make the same mistakes. For me a 2-3 year diploma program was the best choice.

One thing I liked about college was the lack of polictics, mine at least just didn't have them, we were all there for simular reasons, to learn and in many cases, make new friends.

What I was always taught that Uni (and four year colleges) are much more theory and you have just as many academic courses (like english, history etc) as you have core subjects of your major. I've heard people complain that it's 'just like HS all over again'. It's also a heck of a lot more expensive and is a lot more political. It also comes accross to me as being much more GPA concerned and how much theory you can remember then it does with what skills you learn.

The fact is that, accademic programs arn't for everyone and a lot of people are being forced into them and ending up miserable.

I remember reading a letter to the editor in the Toronto star a while back from a Principal that has (IIRC) 30+ experience and he talked about this very issue of how we're all programed to go to UNI when not everyone is accedemincally inclined and how for many, college would be a much more practical hands on apporach. However, beause everyone is programed with the notion that they must get a degree, a lot that aren't accademically inclined are ending up fubared because they're being forced into programs and schools that just arn't right for them.

ZenZhu · Coadjutor Joined: 22 Mar 2004 Posts: 475

Someone mentioned to me once that the college they went to waaay back when (this guy was almost 90) had "tracks." There was the academic track, of course, but there were also ones that were more.. I dunno what you'd call it.. "trade-related?" The idea was that there were definitely those of an academic bent, but that there should be other course outlines for people that were not academically-inclined but quite skilled in other areas.

I really think this would be a great thing to get back to. I agree with the idea of core courses.. English, history, etc. to make you more well-rounded, but maybe not so many core courses. The university I went to consisted about 50-50 between core courses and major-related courses. So, you had the requirements of English, History, Chemistry, Physics, etc. I think a small sampling of general courses is good.. again, to sort of round-out a person's education. But, really, physics and calculus aren't really necessary if they're going into interior decorating. Physics I might be good for general purposes, but why make everyone take Physics II?

So, if a person isn't inclined to follow an academic track, why not make other things available to them that play up their other skills? Carpentry, design, a gift for languages.. whatever.

Colleges, particularly at the graduate school level, however, do tend to get a bit too focused on the Ivory Tower area. My schooling in geology, for example, was well-suited for if I was going to be a college professor. But, it didn't do a whole lot for working in the 9-5, non-academic world. The courses definitely helped, but there's a lot of considerations that go onto "working" geology, versus academic geology, that they didn't cover. For example, if I was working up a course outline for a "working" geology emphasis, I'd definitely include some basic business courses. The business skills I've picked up have come very much in handy... but I wish I could have picked them up before I had to learn them 5 seconds before I had to use them.

viron · Apocrisiary Joined: 04 Mar 2004 Posts: 49

There were some people from HS there of course, but I found that they acted much more mature and nicer then in high school. It was weird, it was like people could finally as they wanted to act and think independantly rather then conforming to 'the way everyone thinks'.

True. I recall many a time running into old bullies that were just nice as rain suddenly after seeing them maybe 2 or 3 years after HS. They were mature, or realized they were retardos in school, or they had families, or they didn't have to worry about keeping up appearances to make it seem they were 'stronger' or 'cool' or anything.

In fact i started seeing that behavior start nearing the end of my senior HS year.

I guess the advice to all the young people out there is stick it out til the end. They'd be surprised to know it does get better on its own because high school is just one big stupid community of immature folks and after that's done people will start acting like real adults.. er, for the most part.

ZenZhu · Coadjutor Joined: 22 Mar 2004 Posts: 475

Yeah.. just remind them that high school may seem like an eternity, but it's really a small chunk of their life.

I had a funny incident with bully troubles in grade school. One of my classmates, who waffled between being friendly and a bully to me, was having a dirt-clod fight with my brother on the kickball field after school (the three of us had parents that worked there, so we went home with them). They were tossing those little dirtballs that disintegrate when barely tapped at each other. Well, my brother, across the distance of a kickball field, accidentally hit this kid square between the eyes with a clod. The kid came after him, and I got in the way. He grabbed me in a headlock. I bit his arm, then turned around and slugged him with a strike (I was in Yoshukai karate at the time) to the eye, leaving him with a nice shiner.

The next day, his story was he fell while running in the woods and hit a stump. He knew I knew better, though. He had been given a black eye by the class nerd. He was very, very nice to me after that day... I dunno if it was out of earned respect, or fear of blackmail. Either way, one less bully to deal with.

Rusty · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 82

In fact i started seeing that behavior start nearing the end of my senior HS year.

Yep, as did I. In my last year or two of HS (keeping in mind this was a five year system when I attended) the people were starting to get a lot more mature and by then the 'making fun of' type of stuff was pretty much done and they were leaving me alone.

Yeah.. just remind them that high school may seem like an eternity, but it's really a small chunk of their life.

Exactly; it's sort of a 'yeah, I know it sucks, I hated it too, pretty much everyone hates it so don't worry about it' kind of thing.