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Wayd Wolf
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Posted: 10/7/2003 2:49:52 AM     Post subject: Copy of Why I came to this forum...  

This is a long story and rant so I will post it to the open forum. I found my way here after someone sent me a link to an article on the main site.

I've been involved with furry somewhat since late 96 or so, peripherally. I'm not an artist but a writer.

While the erotic and spooge are fine with me, and some lifestyler silliness at times, I've come to realize there's a huge number of severely fucked people in it who are totally obsessive-compulsive in their derelict behaviours whcih keep them losers.

Over the years a fair number of people have come to me as if I'm the only person who can fix their lives and most have simply kicked me in the nuts with spectacular rejections of my advice, but continued saddling me with their problems and fetishes.

The worst part was when the AAC98 staff was nice enough to extend my then fiance and I the opportunity to have a marriage performance at the con. All through the time after, NO ONE gave me one peep of problems.

A few days after, the onslaught of threats, abuse, and worse came via e-mail. My wife was savaged worse than I and they said things I'd not say often and I speak fluent obscenity. The reason? A bunch of fursuiters decided it wasn't fair that someone they didn't really perceive as a true furry got the plum reward of holding his wedding at AAC98 while they had their precious fursuit contest interrupted and they were forced to sweat like hogs while they waited for resumption.

I noted that no one had a problem with the ultrafictitious wedding of Roxi-Kat and Jack Salem which IMMEDIATELLY followed my own.

(addition: Some asshole fursuiter even spread the rumor I was going to "knife people" at AC99 and I was removed from the AC art show volunteer staff by PeterCat under EXTREME pressure from Conway, and this miscreant rumor monger had a number of notable artists threatening Conway with not coming much less having a dealer table if I were to attend. PeterCat apologized profusely and I KNOW him to be a man of better ethics and character than a number of other people associated with AC so he's cool. Conway on the other hand seems self-important and full of his own "Uncle Kage" reputation and if that isn't his doing, he does NOTHING to stop the creation of it by his fawning ninnies circling about, so we're talking guilt by inaction.)

Well, over the years I've reached the breaking point and had more than enough of the self-destructive horseshit and the self-pity and the constant shielding of the worst miscreants by the bulk of the furry fandom who defend them as if I attacked them, in the style of "methinks they doth protest too much". i.e., they see themselves in my whacks and become defensive themselves.

Furry has become a rotten cesspool. A fandom obsessed with sex but utterly devoid of real sex. A fandom which claims to be more emotional and passionate than anyone else, but is as truly passionate as a hunk of granite. A fandom which paints itself as kinder and nicer than anyone else, but more apt to backstab, cheat, lie, savage, and degrade others than any other group I've been amongst.

Offer ten average male furs a free bareback ride on a willing female, and 9.9 of them will find a way to either screw themselves out of it, or purposely get out of it in fright, then later on brag about getting in the same room with a naked woman. We're talking people not brilliant enough to get laid when the tail is HANDED to them.

Furry is a nice hobby, but it is full of severely screwed up people.

Of course, we could get into their total lack of fortitude and willpower, instead being ultra lazy to the point of condemning themselves to permanent lower class economic status. People who complain about how hard it is to work ten hours a week at a convenience store.

Yet, furry is full of incredibly smart people. Smart... technically. Not socially. Not realistically. Well, being able to recompile Linux nine times a day and design Flash isn't a substitute for being able to grok that showering more than once a week, using soap when you do, not dressing like your mother just sent you to day camp, and speaking full coherent sentences on mundane subjects outside of furry is integral, among other things, to functioning among other people.

To stop the rambling, I guess what it boils down to with so many in furry is cowardice and stupidity. A cowardice and stupidity that in combination or alone are so strong that it will mean they will destroy their reputations and social place in the greater society and go down screaming pious nonsense about persecution, conspiracies, and mundanes even as the solutions to all their problems was within them all along.

Even Quozl could one day get straightened out and have a wonderful life with acclaim in his own life from family and friends, a place in society, and a future and then leave a legacy as others do every day. I am NOT saying he or the others ever will.

I can't be counselor to the problem furries anymore. I can't take the bulk of furry who aren't totally dysfunctional (YET) ignoring or even defending those who are. I'd love to straighten them all out. But I can't. I don't think all of those who've got the ability to function in open society properly acting in concert could.

Burned Fur wasn't a solution with the Commie and Nazi imagery and the way over the top manner. The only solution is to do anthropomorphics on the side away from furry, keeping it sci-fi/fantasy, and let the core of furry implode on itself and self-destruct. That's what's going to happen anyhow so the only way to keep anthropomorphics from going down with furry is to keep what we can to ourselves, we who aren't fucked in the head, and let those who are burn themselves and furry out.

(addition: I have a number of fur friends who still tell me of various schmucks making threatening talk about me behind my back, any of whom I've crossed paths with at AC who have turned and hurriedly fled my presence when I smiled and they noticed my name tag. This fandom is full of would be Highlanders and Rambos who have not the slightest idea of what fighting and being hurt is about and sooner or later will get themselves seriously screwed if not dead when they spout off to the wrong person one day. I save my fighting abilities for real men, and most real men DO NOT start altercations without knowing full well what they are doing and risking. Some furries are like would-be Columbine twits, but played by a cross between Jerry Lewis and Bondage Bob. Tragedy is coming to these idiots sooner or later and furry not taking this seriously, especially with the free wheeling "screw anyone over you can on Furrymuck" attitude in combination. Wars have been fought over very little more than emotion and many furries go out of their way to foster very bad emotions in others.)
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thegunman
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Posted: 10/7/2003 6:07:31 AM     Post subject: why i joined the board  

i ran across the fandom while searching the web one night looking up artwork for a project a friend had for school. i was linked to a couple of sites and decide to take a look. i'm not prejudice( i belive in the saying "to each his own") but i dislike furry for a number of reasons. out of the fandom the only thing i had any intrest in was some of the art, the rest after veiwing i either didn't care for or pissed me off.

first off, out of all the art only about 10% of it is any good, imo. the rest is either porno, stupidly violent or looks to be drawn by a five year old.
some of the comics were pretty funny but mostly delt with stupid plots and revolved around either romance or colleage :roll: . as far as the writings go i only liked a couple in fact 2 stories out there, the rest as i said before mostly they deal with stupid plots and revolved around either romance or colleage :roll:. another thing with the fandom that really got to me was in my week long investigation, almost all the artists and authors are anti-2nd ammendment and anti-hunting. do to this simple fact about their little organization i am simpliy against thier movement and what they stand for.

the furry fandoms hidden agenda pisses me off. if you can't tell be my name i'm pro gun, pro hunting and aside from that anti porn( whitch more than half of all furry is). so i don't support furries and veiw thier liberial, human hating, eco terrorist propaganda as threating and childish, and i love to debate them (among other group) and putting them down. :twisted:

to end my first post, my impression of the furry circle is of a oganization of people with no real life and hate who they really are. sad but true if you really read between the lines. :(
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mouse
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Posted: 10/7/2003 6:36:14 AM     Post subject: Re: why i joined the board  

almost all the artists and authors are anti-2nd ammendment and anti-hunting. do to this simple fact about their little organization i am simpliy against thier movement and what they stand for.

the furry fandoms hidden agenda pisses me off.


this is one of those 'furry myths' that i have no idea where people get it from

aside from anti-hunting banner that come from the dutch furs newsfeed none of it goes anywhere

and please dont make the mistake of thinking furries have some sort of agenda
the only agenda is wanking off to more fetish porn

i , more than anyone , wish it werent the case , but its unfortunatly true

if you can't tell be my name i'm pro gun, pro hunting and aside from that anti porn( whitch more than half of all furry is). so i don't support furries and veiw thier liberial, human hating, eco terrorist propaganda as threating and childish, and i love to debate them (among other group) and putting them down. :twisted:

to end my first post, my impression of the furry circle is of a oganization of people with no real life and hate who they really are. sad but true if you really read between the lines. :(


you must have missed out out on the crazy ass flame wars that start every week
youd think furries are heavily right wing the way they react to everything youve mentioned

btw i dont feel like getting into anything

but im very pro-gun
and very anti-hunting

i support nuclear power
and SEMA backed legislation and policy

otherwise im very left - socialist

so dont start calling people commies and liberals
liberal literally has NO meaning whatsoever (at least hasnt in many many years)
anyone who says it does (left or right wing) is a moron

it sounds really ignorant to throw it around
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The New Meat
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Posted: 10/7/2003 6:44:57 AM     Post subject: Re: Copy of Why I came to this forum...  



While the erotic and spooge are fine with me, and some lifestyler silliness at times, I've come to realize there's a huge number of severely fucked people in it who are totally obsessive-compulsive in their derelict behaviours whcih keep them losers.


I think that's a statement we can all get behind. Oh, and welcome to the board!



Over the years a fair number of people have come to me as if I'm the only person who can fix their lives and most have simply kicked me in the nuts with spectacular rejections of my advice, but continued saddling me with their problems and fetishes.


Details! I demand details of furry whineassity!

(addition: Some asshole fursuiter even spread the rumor I was going to "knife people" at AC99 and I was removed from the AC art show volunteer staff by PeterCat under EXTREME pressure from Conway, and this miscreant rumor monger had a number of notable artists threatening Conway with not coming much less having a dealer table if I were to attend. PeterCat apologized profusely and I KNOW him to be a man of better ethics and character than a number of other people associated with AC so he's cool. Conway on the other hand seems self-important and full of his own "Uncle Kage" reputation and if that isn't his doing, he does NOTHING to stop the creation of it by his fawning ninnies circling about, so we're talking guilt by inaction.)


Once again, I'm an ignorant dolt: Who's Uncle Kage? Isn't he a G.I. Joe character or something?

I would give anything to see a real furry knife fight.


>the furry fandoms hidden agenda pisses me off. if you can't tell be my name i'm pro gun, pro hunting and aside from that anti porn( whitch more than half of all furry is). so i don't support furries and veiw thier liberial, human hating, eco terrorist propaganda as threating and childish, and i love to debate them (among other group) and putting them down.


Um. It's not exactly a hidden agenda. It's pretty much out there in the open. The hidden agenda would be the one where they infiltrate all the schools and teach our kids to become lesbian witches.

So you like guns and hunting and hate porn, eh? Is that you, mom? Say hi to everyone back in West Virginia for me! And keep digging for that subterranean coal mine-dwelling rainbow. You can do it!
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mouse
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Posted: 10/7/2003 7:27:52 AM     Post subject:  

actually ive come to notice that

ANYONE who's contact with furry was solely thru the internet thinks its fucked beyond belief

meanwhile the guys still hanging on
are the ones who got in thru comic books (or draw them or whatever)
i mean theres some saner furries who are just into livejournals and mucks and what not

im just making a general comparison

i mean i starting snooping around furry sites on the internet but hit pressed fur right away and spent weeks reading the whole site
it didnt seem so bad

shortly afterward i went to rabbit valley an bought some comic books because i thought it was a comic book based fandom and i wanted 'to see for myself' what it was about
to this day i still dont know where i drew that initial conclusion from

now, am i the ONLY person whos done this in the past 5 years? (gotten into furry thru comic books)
the fucks goin on??

anyway in the paper comic world of furry its a stretch to say say 50% porn

online art , absolutely
does most of it suck ..well thats an opinion but id agree

but the comics:
http://www.radiocomix.com/adultcatalogindex.html

theres one source - take a look
radios one of the main furry publishers

most of that shit is just human/anime based cartoon porn milk! and some of the others

genus and skunkworks is about it for furry
and filthy animals is NOT porn

SFA has katmandu XXX or some shit
and Mu has a few adult titles but i dont even know if they have specifically
PORN

so im just saying people need to recognize there are STILL 2 teirs of furry
2 very different dynamics going on

is one on the way out ? who knows
im just syaing its still there



also wayd:

Burned Fur wasn't a solution with the Commie and Nazi imagery and the way over the top manner. The only solution is to do anthropomorphics on the side away from furry, keeping it sci-fi/fantasy, and let the core of furry implode on itself and self-destruct. That's what's going to happen anyhow so the only way to keep anthropomorphics from going down with furry is to keep what we can to ourselves, we who aren't fucked in the head, and let those who are burn themselves and furry out.


yes like i said on AFF a few times, thats really my only concern is anthropomorphics

alot of people say , that they only dont like 'furries themselves'
they dont have problems with people who do anthropomorphics

but thats bullshit

if your drawing funny animals
you gonna get pegged

you still gonna get the "is this that furry shit?" guy


thats what has to change
its all gotta change

and thats my main #1 problem with all this shit
its really the only reason i even want to see change in furry fandom
i think it might be impossible to actually seperate the 2
MU publishes "furry" comics period
furrlough is 'the funny animal anthology' but, cmon everyone KNOWS
and radio still publishes furry stuff
shit they publish kemono stuff like wild zoo
and thats dark as hell to boot (so ive heard)

Some furries are like would-be Columbine twits, but played by a cross between Jerry Lewis and Bondage Bob. Tragedy is coming to these idiots sooner or later and furry not taking this seriously, especially with the free wheeling "screw anyone over you can on Furrymuck" attitude in combination. Wars have been fought over very little more than emotion and many furries go out of their way to foster very bad emotions in others.)


haha
i dont know bondage bob (thankfully) but the jerry lewis part did it for me
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Mitch
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Posted: 10/7/2003 7:30:25 AM     Post subject: Re: Copy of Why I came to this forum...  

Hi, Wayd. Thanks for that post, and welcome to our little boards.


Once again, I'm an ignorant dolt: Who's Uncle Kage? Isn't he a G.I. Joe character or something?


This page will explain who Uncle Kage is. The world is not yet ready for an Uncle Kage action figure...
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thegunman
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Posted: 10/7/2003 7:32:55 AM     Post subject:  

wow that was quick,
ok my choice of words may have not been the best when i mentioned "the hidden agenda", from the perseption i got in the furry sites i came across.

i'm not saying all furries support everything i mention (anit gun, anti hunting and pro porn), but almost every site i visited supported at least one throught their artwork or other means( links, personal opinon ect.).

i saw banners for links to anti gun and anti hunting organizations on many website and parts in some stories that were along these lines.

as for the porn issue, i dislike porn human or animal. i belive it is something that hurt societiy and promotes immoral behavior.

this is a better explenation of why i disapprove of most furries. this is why i dislike the majority of the furry scene.
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DA
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Posted: 10/7/2003 7:45:13 PM     Post subject: been there done that...  

Even got my own furry Stalker :P

Furry's can be normal or fucked up totally..there is no middle ground with them.
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Wayd Wolf
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Posted: 10/8/2003 2:16:36 AM     Post subject:  

wow that was quick,
ok my choice of words may have not been the best when i mentioned "the hidden agenda", from the perseption i got in the furry sites i came across.


It's easy to get that feeling.

i'm not saying all furries support everything i mention (anit gun, anti hunting and pro porn), but almost every site i visited supported at least one throught their artwork or other means( links, personal opinon ect.).

i saw banners for links to anti gun and anti hunting organizations on many website and parts in some stories that were along these lines.

as for the porn issue, i dislike porn human or animal. i belive it is something that hurt societiy and promotes immoral behavior.


I am rabidly pro-porn, having been shot at and done the shooting. I ain't proud of or happy about my misspent youth. But I can tell you a few things.

First, people busy killing others are never busy making anyone orgasmically happy. People busy making others orgasmically happy are never killing people. You never see an orgy break out at a gunfight. You never see gunfights break out at orgies. After a gunfight, you have to deal with the aftermath and its reprocussions to you physically, socially, spiritually, emotionally, and legally. After an orgy, you pretty much light up a cigarette, take a leak, and watch TV as you drift off. (What, am I the only after-sex traditionalist?)

Second, more people die every year, unhappy, alone, miserable, in excrutiating pain than are enjoying themselves. The world is full of people who just can't seem to give pleasure to others, teach others to give pleasure, and instead derive very temporary pleasure by hurting others as much as they can.

Imagine for a second a world where arguments were settled in bed. Instead of over a pair of pistols, flying FMJ, and blood splatter. Imagine a world where people spent more time putting silly blissful smiles on others than arguing stupid arguments over meaningless things.

It's a dream, a small one I know, but a cherished one. In the meantime, it is best not to fuck with people you don't for certain know you can put down to room temperature before they do it to you. It takes less than a second to die. It takes a lot longer to make a friend. The lazy first choice is permanent and offers no second chance. The harder second choice is obviously the better one.

I am all in favor of porn. People need more fun. But they need to be able to have a balance. I understand the epicurean hedonist thing in modern society where people avoid pain to have pleasure, but we're talking a society that creates more pain than it avoids and experiences less pleasure than it sets out to, and furry is a heightened and amplified example of that.


this is a better explenation of why i disapprove of most furries. this is why i dislike the majority of the furry scene.


I dislike the majority of it because of a few things I've already stated. Another important one is that the lifestylers make it a litmus test for one's very right to be treated with respect and dignity as to whether or not you not only accept their right to believe whatever they believe, but you also believe it yourself.

I've experienced a lot of things. Spiritual things. I've had a lifelong case of deja vu on overdrive. I hear songs in my head moments before I click on a radio channel, I finish other people's trains of thought for them, and I anticipate a load of things every day. I have certain beliefs. I know what I know. I DO NOT MAKE IT A TEST OF YOUR RIGHT TO EXIST AS TO WHETHER OR NOT YOU BELIEVE ME.

I couldn't care less as to whether or not you do.

But the lifestyler contingent cannot expect to be taken seriously if they demand that people believe that they were in a former life a nine tailed Japanese mythical fox reborn into a Celtic priestess before they were reborn as some shmoe from the burbs of greater Minneapolis who can't say "hello" to an elligible woman without breaking out in a fit, or hold a job that pays more than minimum wage and lasts more than ten hours a week, or hold a conversation that doesn't have the words "yiff", "spooge", "nutella", or "vixen" appear anywhere during it.

Personally, furry porn if it was taken in the spirit it should be, as inspiration to do some real life screwing, would be fine. Screwing generally involves conversation with the other person, emotions being shared, passions stirring, some slight bonding... But we're talking people who use it as a shield against all that. Interpersonal interaction is something they actually avoid, at least as normal people would see them.

Chatting online in AOL'er shorthand about yiffy vixens and so on isn't the same as actually being personally connected with another person. Even strangers arguing over the Red Sox and Yankees at Dunkin Donuts are getting closer to each other than most furries ever really get to their fellow fanatics.

Man, but I did ramble...
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mouse
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Posted: 10/8/2003 8:08:07 AM     Post subject:  

I am rabidly pro-porn, having been shot at and done the shooting. I ain't proud of or happy about my misspent youth. But I can tell you a few things.


did you mean pro-gun ?

anyway the only reason i am pro-gun (and i dont even own guns)
is simple for the fact its in the constitution

when people say that the founding fathers "werent thinking of machine guns etc.." actually they might as well have been

there was a period of time when a blackpowder rifle was a fiercesome weapon

there was a time when the winchester repeating rifle was amazing firepower

i dont think the 2nd amendment has anything to do with self-defence OR hunting either

it has to do with national security (not this post-9/11 tom ridge shit) and even more importantly:

ensuring 'consent of the governed'

remember these guys founded the country on the writings of john locke
he said that the populace has an OBLIGATION to overthrow corrupt leadership

dictatorships cant really form in nations where the population is heavily armed..or has access to weapons

look at south america
as bad as that is...those dictators dont last , because the population runs up into the mountains and starts fighting guerilla warfare until the government collapses again


ya it can be dangerous but that more a symptom of the social decay in america
theres something wrong with our culture
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Wayd Wolf
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Posted: 10/8/2003 7:31:02 PM     Post subject:  

I am rabidly pro-porn, having been shot at and done the shooting. I ain't proud of or happy about my misspent youth. But I can tell you a few things.


did you mean pro-gun ?


No, I meant pro-PORN. People need to get down, get dirty, get laid, and cut loose with each other. The alternative is well, the last ten thousand years of warfare. Wars burn cities to the ground, spread plague and whatnot, and result in a lot of unhappy assholes who will then make everyone after them unhappy until they repeat it in a few generations and keep doing it until they forget the stupid reason they started in the first place.

I am also pro-gun. I am very much pro 2nd amendment, and know very well from history that any populace which trusts in the state in all things is too cowardly and stupid for their own good. People who support gun control are like problem furries. Afraid of dealing with the realities of life and too stupid to see it. There ARE bad evil people around and they will KILL you if they can IF they get it in their head to do so. If you can't be bothered to defend your own arse, then why should anyone else do it?

anyway the only reason i am pro-gun (and i dont even own guns)
is simple for the fact its in the constitution

when people say that the founding fathers "werent thinking of machine guns etc.." actually they might as well have been

there was a period of time when a blackpowder rifle was a fiercesome weapon

there was a time when the winchester repeating rifle was amazing firepower

i dont think the 2nd amendment has anything to do with self-defence OR hunting either

it has to do with national security (not this post-9/11 tom ridge shit) and even more importantly:

ensuring 'consent of the governed'

remember these guys founded the country on the writings of john locke
he said that the populace has an OBLIGATION to overthrow corrupt leadership

dictatorships cant really form in nations where the population is heavily armed..or has access to weapons

look at south america
as bad as that is...those dictators dont last , because the population runs up into the mountains and starts fighting guerilla warfare until the government collapses again


I used to be in the survivalist movement to some small part and walked away when I realized that people like Aaron Zelman of the JPFO(Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership) were being largely ignored as a positive while white supremacists and anti-government conspiracy nutjobs were being totally ignored as a dangerous cancer in the entire thing. The whole Oklahoma City thing put a total end to American gun-toting survivalism pretty much permanently just as the whole Waco thing gave it a boost not long before.

I don't believe open revolt is necessary. I'd hate to see it happen. But not so much that I wouldn't take part if it came to it. But it HASN'T. We STILL have a vibrant representative democratic republic going and we'd have to be nationally under martial law with a president for life to be at that stage.

BUT, we could easily end up there given the nature of man to, when engaged in politics, gather and conserve power to themselves for its own sake rather than wielding it on behalf of the governed. We need to remain armed and smart enough to improvise our own, we need to remain an unruly loud bunch willing to shout at the statehouses and Washington our pleasures and displeasures whether left or right.

But we need to recognize that the left is totally enthusiastic about the power of the state to bring its police powers against the commoners because they know very well their ideas won't fly on a fair democratic basis half the time. If we had direct participatory democracy, we'd likely not be taxing ourselves into oblivion and voting all sorts of special interests large amounts of our paychecks. Watch the left. They are always the party of exclusion and division, racial and sexual politicking, and always trying to get one group or another against every other.

As someone part American Indian, I know this too well. Let a liberal think I'm purely white(whatever that is) and I'm some scumbag mechanism in the straight(I'm bi) white(part Indian) Christian(Catholic-Protestant mix) male(yes I am and proudly) hegemony(why do they insist on that word?). If they know I'm part Mic Mac, they want to talk to me about how white people oppressed my people and raped my land, and ask if I can make them a dreamcatcher. They have a weird patronizing cartoony idea about anyone not white which boils down to them having a sense of superiority over everyone else. IOW, I CANNOT succeed as a an individual but only as their pet. They can (expletive deleted) my (expletive delted) and kiss my (expletive deleted).

ya it can be dangerous but that more a symptom of the social decay in america
theres something wrong with our culture


We make it easy for manipulation because we as I said elsewhere engage in feeling sorry for ourselves and not taking responsibility for our lives and then look to blame anything but ourselves. I'm not suggesting the mass media needs a wholesome cleansing, I'm flatly stating the American public needs to kick itself in the backside and start acting as though each individual is responsible for themselves and not a weak little cog in an overwhelming machine. When that attitude sets in, all bets are off.

Combine it with the systematic dysfunctional attributes of the problem kids in furry, and you get what we have today: people acting any way they can to make themselves temporarily feel good no matter what the expense to others, and doing it over and over, believing fiercely that they can do no wrong and others can do no right. This is why you have people almost normal like Kage loudly telling others not to talk to the press, and then blabbering to the press themselves, never mind Ostrich and the rest. I shudder to think about some of the militant lifestyler zoos getting in front of the news cameras. They WILL NOT shut up and view it as their spiritual duty to sound off about the joys of their fetishes whenever possible.
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mouse
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Posted: 10/9/2003 5:26:09 AM     Post subject:  

I am also pro-gun. I am very much pro 2nd amendment, and know very well from history that any populace which trusts in the state in all things is too cowardly and stupid for their own good. People who support gun control are like problem furries. Afraid of dealing with the realities of life and too stupid to see it. There ARE bad evil people around and they will KILL you if they can IF they get it in their head to do so. If you can't be bothered to defend your own arse, then why should anyone else do it?


well like i said , ill never be vocal against guns mainly just for the fact you can kill anyone with anything so..to me its a moot point

america is a violent society

I used to be in the survivalist movement to some small part and walked away when I realized that people like Aaron Zelman of the JPFO(Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership) were being largely ignored as a positive while white supremacists and anti-government conspiracy nutjobs were being totally ignored as a dangerous cancer in the entire thing. The whole Oklahoma City thing put a total end to American gun-toting survivalism pretty much permanently just as the whole Waco thing gave it a boost not long before.


dont get me wrong dude, i dont like either of those groups

that survivalist shit annoys me
the governemnt conspiracy stuff is cool tho

i just believe in balance
the more extreme elements that exist, the more extreme elements id like to see in the opposite direction
not because id like total chaos or constant clashing and confrontation but just rather its easy to avoid all of it - or it tends to be out in the open more

or so its not so 'unfair'


or plan B, is that after the shit REALLY goes down and the nukes get dropped , the weapons gotta be laying around in abundance so that i am able to battle my way across the wasteland to some abandoned nuke silo, remove the warhead and transport it to whatever 'bartertown' or post apocolyptic L.A. and set it off smashing what little remains of human civilization

im just trying to figure out whether my group is going to be just a bunch of psycho suicidal scavengers/raiders - or maybe i should go the religious zealot route and start a cult

WORSHIP THE BOMB

(i play them fallout games)

I don't believe open revolt is necessary. I'd hate to see it happen. But not so much that I wouldn't take part if it came to it. But it HASN'T. We STILL have a vibrant representative democratic republic going and we'd have to be nationally under martial law with a president for life to be at that stage.


neither do i
i just personally believe that was the purpose for the 2nd amendment to be there
just one more addition to the 'checks and balances'




But we need to recognize that the left is totally enthusiastic about the power of the state to bring its police powers against the commoners because they know very well their ideas won't fly on a fair democratic basis half the time. If we had direct participatory democracy, we'd likely not be taxing ourselves into oblivion and voting all sorts of special interests large amounts of our paychecks. Watch the left. They are always the party of exclusion and division, racial and sexual politicking, and always trying to get one group or another against every other.


the thign is wayd, get this:

its a fucking non-partisan issue
yes, the line has been drawn
but there is no reason gun rights cant be left wing "thing"
it just wound up that the right wing grabbed onto that one
these proto-fascists on office right now - they PANDER the lobbies liek the NRA ...for NOW -- you think they are gonna want a wildcard like 'citizens with guns' out there ? ..i dont think so

gun-owners are one issue voters and thats the truth
republican: "hey billy bob , vote for me, and after im in office - im going to fuck you in the ass with this here 2x4...but ill let you keep yer huntin rifle"

works everytime

fact: poor rural whites, typically vote right wingers into office - virtually guaranteeing they will be the first to get fucked by the policies that get implemented
just look at the farm crisis in this country

im blue collar for life
and i primarily support labor issues
the only thing i have disagreements with MY class about is being uneducated in politics
most of the guys i know ARE redneck hunters that vote 'right-wing' then bitch and moan about medical bills they cant pay, fucked up roads/schools the list goes on and on
and all the other shit that goes wrong when these right wing politicians try to starve out social services

you can throw the irrelevant term liberal around all you want man, like i already stated it doesnt mean shit

the fact that the term is applied to people who supposedly want to legalize drugs AND outlaw tobacco shows it - and its not party confusion
the "liberal" no longer exists - its a slur and thats it
some left wingers call themselves liberals...i do not

see i believe in BIG government that keeps out of people's personal business (very much so - and by personal business i mean mainly thier lives - unless services are needed that everyone will need at some point)
sound like an oxymoron ? its not


and furthermore, we REALLY gotta get away from this 2 party system
its nothing but trouble
id like to see a more accurate (approx) 6 party system
because then its more about issues and less about votes and staying in office

-mouse

if i could, i would be one too someday>
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Anonymous
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Posted: 10/9/2003 12:24:35 PM     Post subject:  


I am also pro-gun. I am very much pro 2nd amendment, and know very well from history that any populace which trusts in the state in all things is too cowardly and stupid for their own good. People who support gun control are like problem furries. Afraid of dealing with the realities of life and too stupid to see it.


Good god man, you should not be repeating such stuff without thinking logically and objectively or at least drawing in more matriel.

First of all, The second amendment sayís that only militias have the right to bear arms, There is no listed individual right to bear arms, and supreme court decision back that view up too.

Anyone who claims otherwise is doing little more than selective interpretation.


There ARE bad evil people around and they will KILL you if they can IF they get it in their head to do so. If you can't be bothered to defend your own arse, then why should anyone else do it?


The world is not black and white.
The world is grey; The Mountains old, the forges fire is ashen cold.
Heh, heh, heh.

But one man's "baddie" is another mans "goodie".
There is no objective judge of morality and ethics.


I don't believe open revolt is necessary. I'd hate to see it happen. But not so much that I wouldn't take part if it came to it. But it HASN'T. We STILL have a vibrant representative democratic republic going and we'd have to be nationally under martial law with a president for life to be at that stage.


If America does have a vibrant democracy, How come an un-elected president rules and the order of the day is crony capitalism?
(observe Enron)


BUT, we could easily end up there given the nature of man to, when engaged in politics, gather and conserve power to themselves for its own sake rather than wielding it on behalf of the governed. We need to remain armed and smart enough to improvise our own, we need to remain an unruly loud bunch willing to shout at the statehouses and Washington our pleasures and displeasures whether left or right.


Funny thing is, the average gun owner is a white middle class republican, so much for power to the people.

Indeed, Guns did not stop Nixon, They did not stop bush, and they did not stop Hitler getting into power.

Guns do not work against people who abuse the democratic process to come to power.


But we need to recognize that the left is totally enthusiastic about the power of the state to bring its police powers against the commoners because they know very well their ideas won't fly on a fair democratic basis half the time. If we had direct participatory democracy, we'd likely not be taxing ourselves into oblivion and voting all sorts of special interests large amounts of our paychecks. Watch the left. They are always the party of exclusion and division, racial and sexual politicking, and always trying to get one group or another against every other.


The last I saw, it was the right wing (republicans) that was proposing things like the patriot act.


As someone part American Indian, I know this too well. Let a liberal think I'm purely white(whatever that is) and I'm some scumbag mechanism in the straight(I'm bi) white(part Indian) Christian(Catholic-Protestant mix) male(yes I am and proudly) hegemony(why do they insist on that word?). If they know I'm part Mic Mac, they want to talk to me about how white people oppressed my people and raped my land, and ask if I can make them a dreamcatcher. They have a weird patronizing cartoony idea about anyone not white which boils down to them having a sense of superiority over everyone else. IOW, I CANNOT succeed as a an individual but only as their pet. They can (expletive deleted) my (expletive delted) and kiss my (expletive deleted).


America was founded on the deliberate genocide and ethnic cleansing of the Native peoples. That is objective fact that you can see reflected in actuality.


We make it easy for manipulation because we as I said elsewhere engage in feeling sorry for ourselves and not taking responsibility for our lives and then look to blame anything but ourselves. I'm not suggesting the mass media needs a wholesome cleansing, I'm flatly stating the American public needs to kick itself in the backside and start acting as though each individual is responsible for themselves and not a weak little cog in an overwhelming machine. When that attitude sets in, all bets are off.


We are all cogs in the machine, Society operates on co-operative parameters.

Mass civil disobedience proves that point, Society depends on us all co-operating with each other and when lots of people donít follow normal rules (like: Donít sit down in the middle of the road) things fall apart.
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Anonymous
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Posted: 10/9/2003 12:41:44 PM     Post subject: Re: Copy of Why I came to this forum...  


While the erotic and spooge are fine with me, and some lifestyler silliness at times, I've come to realize there's a huge number of severely fucked people in it who are totally obsessive-compulsive in their derelict behaviours whcih keep them losers.


You mean like almost everywhere else?


Over the years a fair number of people have come to me as if I'm the only person who can fix their lives and most have simply kicked me in the nuts with spectacular rejections of my advice, but continued saddling me with their problems and fetishes.


I've never heard names or figures mentioned, can you cite any?


Well, over the years I've reached the breaking point and had more than enough of the self-destructive horseshit and the self-pity and the constant shielding of the worst miscreants by the bulk of the furry fandom who defend them as if I attacked them, in the style of "methinks they doth protest too much". i.e., they see themselves in my whacks and become defensive themselves.


I do not see mine own self in thine whacks, Yet I concearn for their broad range and brushstrokes, for when it comes to the details, They are somewhat lacking.

Can you give specific and consistent examples to back up all teh complaints you make, and balence them against the good things?


Furry has become a rotten cesspool. A fandom obsessed with sex but utterly devoid of real sex. A fandom which claims to be more emotional and passionate than anyone else, but is as truly passionate as a hunk of granite. A fandom which paints itself as kinder and nicer than anyone else, but more apt to backstab, cheat, lie, savage, and degrade others than any other group I've been amongst.


Nah, you see the same things and patterns everywhere, Furry is no exception.


Offer ten average male furs a free bareback ride on a willing female, and 9.9 of them will find a way to either screw themselves out of it, or purposely get out of it in fright, then later on brag about getting in the same room with a naked woman. We're talking people not brilliant enough to get laid when the tail is HANDED to them.


Proof?


Furry is a nice hobby, but it is full of severely screwed up people.

Of course, we could get into their total lack of fortitude and willpower, instead being ultra lazy to the point of condemning themselves to permanent lower class economic status. People who complain about how hard it is to work ten hours a week at a convenience store.


Heh, Depends how it is. I worked 12 hours a week at a supermarket, Yet there was constant pressure on me to work more hours, The mangagement worked by threatening to sack people unless they did what ever they told them too.

And that did suck, I needed the money, They knew this, And tried to play me like a flute. Always makeing unreasonably demands, even suggesting that I should miss some school in order to work more hours.

These problems happen to everyone involved in the high turnover low secruity service sector.


To stop the rambling, I guess what it boils down to with so many in furry is cowardice and stupidity.


Hmm, like with almost everything else?


Even Quozl could one day get straightened out and have a wonderful life with acclaim in his own life from family and friends, a place in society, and a future and then leave a legacy as others do every day. I am NOT saying he or the others ever will.


I would blame that on civil society (it being the framework we all inhabit) rather than a constrcut within the framework.


I can't be counselor to the problem furries anymore. I can't take the bulk of furry who aren't totally dysfunctional (YET) ignoring or even defending those who are. I'd love to straighten them all out. But I can't.


Well don' t then. I'd love to wave a magic wand and ensure justice for all, But at the end of the day, I have to live.


The only solution is to do anthropomorphics on the side away from furry, keeping it sci-fi/fantasy, and let the core of furry implode on itself and self-destruct.


Can you illustrate you hypothesis with any examples or anything?


Wars have been fought over very little more than emotion and many furries go out of their way to foster very bad emotions in others.)


I would say that most wars are fought for matriel reasons, I.e "I want power", "we want his land" etc.
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Wayd Wolf
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Posted: 10/9/2003 3:41:52 PM     Post subject:  


I am also pro-gun. I am very much pro 2nd amendment, and know very well from history that any populace which trusts in the state in all things is too cowardly and stupid for their own good. People who support gun control are like problem furries. Afraid of dealing with the realities of life and too stupid to see it.


Good god man, you should not be repeating such stuff without thinking logically and objectively or at least drawing in more matriel.

First of all, The second amendment sayís that only militias have the right to bear arms, There is no listed individual right to bear arms, and supreme court decision back that view up too.

Anyone who claims otherwise is doing little more than selective interpretation.


You're the one doing selective interpretation, or merely re-reading that done by gun control fanatics. If you bother to read the writings of the very men who wrote the 2nd ammendment, they make it EXCRUTIATINGLY CLEAR that it was intended to protect the right of the common man to be armed as a bulwark against tyranny. The gun control crowd ALWAYS glosses that over and creatively reinterprets the thing based on their modern view of what the words state, not the INTENT of the writers who DO clarify their intent in the other writings repeatedly.


There ARE bad evil people around and they will KILL you if they can IF they get it in their head to do so. If you can't be bothered to defend your own arse, then why should anyone else do it?


The world is not black and white.
The world is grey; The Mountains old, the forges fire is ashen cold.
Heh, heh, heh.

But one man's "baddie" is another mans "goodie".
There is no objective judge of morality and ethics.


Which is the concept on which the bad apples of furry base, when they attempt to be intellectual, their idiot behaviours. "You can't judge us. There's no objective standpoint for anyone to judge us."

WRONG.


I don't believe open revolt is necessary. I'd hate to see it happen. But not so much that I wouldn't take part if it came to it. But it HASN'T. We STILL have a vibrant representative democratic republic going and we'd have to be nationally under martial law with a president for life to be at that stage.


If America does have a vibrant democracy, How come an un-elected president rules and the order of the day is crony capitalism?
(observe Enron)


Do you EVER think before you post? No, I know from sparring with you at a.f.f that you don't. The current president WAS elected and all the vote counting afterward, taking into account even the Gore loonies' nonsense, STILL had him with a majority. But since you're an out and out socialist, I don't expect you to grasp that.


BUT, we could easily end up there given the nature of man to, when engaged in politics, gather and conserve power to themselves for its own sake rather than wielding it on behalf of the governed. We need to remain armed and smart enough to improvise our own, we need to remain an unruly loud bunch willing to shout at the statehouses and Washington our pleasures and displeasures whether left or right.


Funny thing is, the average gun owner is a white middle class republican, so much for power to the people.


Please pull your racialist head out of your butt and grasp that gun control affects MILLIONS of non-white and non-Christian gun owners. My black friends who own guns aren't any happier about gun control than I am and they too have a healthy distrust of the all-powerful state. The Indians have a very big distrust and well-earned and proven, and then reproven when a conflict over tribal sovereignty occurs and the local government threatens to send state troopers onto the reservation.

Indeed, Guns did not stop Nixon, They did not stop bush, and they did not stop Hitler getting into power.


Instant Godwin! And the UK Socialists are toast!

Guns do not work against people who abuse the democratic process to come to power.


This from a product of the cradle to grave UK nanny state.

Dave, we KICKED England's butt to gain our freedom and did it AGAIN in 1812. Guns sure as Hell DO work against people who would abuse the people. Sorry if that hits close to home, but I have as little tolerance for Brits preaching against the rights of individuals and hawking the wonders of the all powerful state as my ancestors did. We weren't going to remain subjects then and I don't want to be a prole for the party now.


But we need to recognize that the left is totally enthusiastic about the power of the state to bring its police powers against the commoners because they know very well their ideas won't fly on a fair democratic basis half the time. If we had direct participatory democracy, we'd likely not be taxing ourselves into oblivion and voting all sorts of special interests large amounts of our paychecks. Watch the left. They are always the party of exclusion and division, racial and sexual politicking, and always trying to get one group or another against every other.


The last I saw, it was the right wing (republicans) that was proposing things like the patriot act.


Name ONE verifiable example of ANYONE having their civil rights trampled as a result of the Patriot Act. Well, you can't. And neither can the rest of the left making noise about it.


As someone part American Indian, I know this too well. Let a liberal think I'm purely white(whatever that is) and I'm some scumbag mechanism in the straight(I'm bi) white(part Indian) Christian(Catholic-Protestant mix) male(yes I am and proudly) hegemony(why do they insist on that word?). If they know I'm part Mic Mac, they want to talk to me about how white people oppressed my people and raped my land, and ask if I can make them a dreamcatcher. They have a weird patronizing cartoony idea about anyone not white which boils down to them having a sense of superiority over everyone else. IOW, I CANNOT succeed as a an individual but only as their pet. They can (expletive deleted) my (expletive delted) and kiss my (expletive deleted).


America was founded on the deliberate genocide and ethnic cleansing of the Native peoples. That is objective fact that you can see reflected in actuality.


And this part-Indian has no desire to take part as a proxy in your battle for socialist supremacy. That happened how many centuries ago? You don't care what happened to the Mic Mac or any other tribe. All you want is another tool to use against the establishment like an emotional crowbar. Well, we ain't your stooges for your politics.


We make it easy for manipulation because we as I said elsewhere engage in feeling sorry for ourselves and not taking responsibility for our lives and then look to blame anything but ourselves. I'm not suggesting the mass media needs a wholesome cleansing, I'm flatly stating the American public needs to kick itself in the backside and start acting as though each individual is responsible for themselves and not a weak little cog in an overwhelming machine. When that attitude sets in, all bets are off.


We are all cogs in the machine, Society operates on co-operative parameters.

Mass civil disobedience proves that point, Society depends on us all co-operating with each other and when lots of people donít follow normal rules (like: Donít sit down in the middle of the road) things fall apart.


That's quite possibly the most obtuse you've ever been here or anywhere else.

YOU are responsible for you. Don't believe me? Feel free to threaten a member of parliament or commit some other illegal act and see who is held responsible. You can scream about society all you like, but YOU are the one who committed the crime. You DO have a choice in your actions and your life is NOT predetermined by fate or society.

If you can't grasp that, then you don't belong in society any more than the other whackjobs who do whatever they feel like then blame everyone but themselves for. YOU make YOUR own choices. Don't whine about coercive circumstance. I've had a gun to my head. You want coercion, that's coercion. I STILL made my choice of replies and actions from that moment, whatever they were(I stood my ground and stared the other guy down and when he lowered his weapon I backhanded him and walked away).
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Mitch
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Posted: 10/9/2003 6:24:51 PM     Post subject: Regarding gun control.....  

Here's a couple of choice quotes from the Nazis on gun control; right-wing states dislike the idea of armed citizens just as much as the left. It's all about control, don't forget

All military type firearms are to be handed in immediately ... The SS, SA and Stahlhelm give every respectable German man the opportunity of campaigning with them. Therefore anyone who does not belong to one of the above named organizations and who unjustifiably nevertheless keeps his weapon ... must be regarded as an enemy of the national government.

Germans who wish to use firearms should join the SS or the SA - ordinary citizens don't need guns, as their having guns doesn't serve the State.


As for England, the English Bill of Rights of 1688 stated:
That Subjects which are Protestants may have Arms for their Defence suitable to their Conditions and as allowed by Law.

And yes, up until 1920 (when the Firearms Act was passed) a Briton could own and carry any weapon he liked. The lack of firearms legislation before that point was not because of low crime rates, but because the possession of arms was seen as a right. The reason for the 1920 Act was because the Establishment had taken fright from the example of the Russian Revolution and were seeing Bolsheviks under the beds.
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Wayd Wolf
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Posted: 10/10/2003 2:21:05 AM     Post subject:  

If you want to look for Nazi admirers, look no further than the gun control crowd people. Go find a copy of the Nazi gun control act of 1938 in German with a direct English translation. Now put next to them a copy of the Gun Control Act of 1968 largely put together by Thomas Dodd. Virtually a complete act of plagiarism. Where did Dodd get it? He was involved with the Nuremburg trials after the war.

Here's a copy from another web forum, and you can judge for yourself whether it is better for people to be disarmed:

56 Million Reasons Why I SUPPORT GUN CONTROL ... By Jim Abrams, Associated Press .... "In 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control. From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, were rounded up and exterminated. "In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, were rounded up and exterminated. "Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, 13 million Jews and others were rounded up and exterminated. "China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, were rounded up and exterminated. "Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, were rounded up and exterminated. "Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, were rounded up and exterminated. "Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one million 'educated' people, were rounded up and exterminated." Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control: 56 million. The next time someone talks in favor of gun control, ask them "Who do YOU want to round up and exterminate?" With guns, we are citizens. Without them, we are subjects. Something to think about.....
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Chris Baird
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Posted: 10/10/2003 3:38:30 AM     Post subject:  

I don't give a fuck about Americans talking about gun controll.
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Anonymous
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Posted: 10/10/2003 5:36:00 AM     Post subject:  

I don't give a fuck about Americans talking about gun controll.


thats understandable

as an american who hangs around several americans in RL who talk about gun control
i can tell you, from personal experience, thats its fucking annoying

(actually im more refering to having to hear about hunting trips and fishing shit..tht just creates awkward situations
but same shit basically....like i mentioned before im only for guns for the 2 reason i mentioned earlier)


and wayd your going way out on a limb there
you should forget left and right wing, these are strange times and things are coming full circle
your having the new left and old right agreeing on stuff

are you aware that 'liberal hippies' and 'neo nazi white supremacists' were both against the whole war thing ? and took issue with the current administration?
i know you can call left wingers 'nazis' hahahohoheeehee, funny
now, back to reality - you know they are not
sorry, but when you have 2 groups that ideologically far apart saying the same thing, one of ems gotta be right


-mouse
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Computolio
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Posted: 10/10/2003 7:19:22 AM     Post subject:  

I don't give a fuck about Americans talking about gun control.
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Anonymous
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Posted: 10/11/2003 3:27:30 PM     Post subject:  


Which is the concept on which the bad apples of furry base, when they attempt to be intellectual, their idiot behaviours. "You can't judge us. There's no objective standpoint for anyone to judge us."

WRONG.


In 1999, on alt.fan.furry,
in article <jzOf3.9235$y92.5226@news.rdc1.ct.home.com>

You (Wayd wolf) wrote:

"My standards are mine. My neighbor's are his. Yours are yours. I
don't eat what you do or read the same things you do. Nor do I care
what you eat or read."

In 1998, on Alt.Fan.Furry, in article <34CCBB3F.65F8@your.door>#1/1

You (wayd Wolf) wrote:

ďI try not to picture myself as ever being morally correct
And when I skate close, I look in the mirror and get sick. I have
No right to be morally superior in anything.Ē

What has changed you since 1999 that you've turned all ranty and odd?

(Just FYI, I have removed all the things which I think are off topic for this forum, If you want me to send you the comprehensive deconstruction of your statement, Just ask, indeed your point about the American war of independence completely ignores the critical role mercantilism played)
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Wayd Wolf
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Posted: 10/11/2003 11:41:54 PM     Post subject:  


Which is the concept on which the bad apples of furry base, when they attempt to be intellectual, their idiot behaviours. "You can't judge us. There's no objective standpoint for anyone to judge us."

WRONG.


In 1999, on alt.fan.furry,
in article <jzOf3.9235$y92.5226@news.rdc1.ct.home.com>

You (Wayd wolf) wrote:

"My standards are mine. My neighbor's are his. Yours are yours. I
don't eat what you do or read the same things you do. Nor do I care
what you eat or read."

In 1998, on Alt.Fan.Furry, in article <34CCBB3F.65F8@your.door>#1/1

You (wayd Wolf) wrote:

ďI try not to picture myself as ever being morally correct
And when I skate close, I look in the mirror and get sick. I have
No right to be morally superior in anything.Ē

What has changed you since 1999 that you've turned all ranty and odd?


Let's just see...

1. Self appointed experts in any given area mistaking their intelligence for experience and wisdom the way you like to think your command of English history, and more to the point of using it as a ready source of distacting non-sequitrs, means anything. Furry is loaded with people who think that ability to do X and knowledge of Y means that they can do or say whatever they want to whoever they want, as much as they like without reprocussions. "Well I'm an expert on Linux so you can't tell me anything..." Sure...

2. Truckloads of furs contacting me via e-mail and chat over six years asking for my advice on love, sex, employment, self-improvement, etc. who then verbally abuse me when I tell them what I've done to be married, own a house, hold a job, etc...

3. Watching open mindedness degenerate into brains falling out on the floor as the attitude of nonjudgementalism was taken to its logical ridiculous extreme in furry behaviour. I used to think that furs could be trusted to know where reality ended and fantasy began but I was soooo wrong.

4. People telling me my wife did not belong in furry because it was for "gay guys" only. My friend Plush-She has similarly been told this at several cons, to her face.

5. Backstabbing, threats, insults, whenever I demurred from taking part in others' fetishes until I realized that those engaging in the behaviour were taking personal offense at the entire world not realizing the so-called brilliance of their furry lifestyle.

See, the problem furries choose to think little of themselves and in their hearts truly don't believe themselves to be capable of meeting any standards of behaviour and decorum. To make up for no self-esteem, ego is used. Mounds of arrogant ego. The kind that makes them temporarily feel good by allowing them to tell themselves that they are the geniuses and cool and hip ones, and that society is stupid and thus its standards do not apply to them.

But like everything else, you make a choice. You choose to not believe in yourself, you choose to wallow in self pity, you choose not to get help, you choose to kick friends in the teeth and reject the advice you asked for, you choose to reject the truth as others see it which you've requested of them. You choose to keep being a problem. Choice.

Why should anyone into anthropomorphics have to suffer the linkage of cretinous self-destructive weirdos as they continually bury themselves like a tick in the hide of furry, and keep making themselves out to be exemplary of it? See, they choose to make furry look bad, we who are smeared along with them had no choice in it other than to complain after the fact.

Sadly, many will not choose to stand up to the masses of dipsticks and insist that they shape up or at least shut up and stop linking themselves to the rest.

Instead, the tolerant silence invites worse because it neglects to take into account another aspect of human nature and that is the soothing feeling of getting attention. So they escalate their weirdness until they are the center of attention and by that point... well, we're pretty well screwed and have zero chance of making greater society ever believe that anthropomorphics is a geniune proper subgenre of fantasy and sci-fi and the schmucks are only an aberration.

If we're silent, society will take it to mean we approve, if not actually take part ourselves. I don't and won't and intend to make it clear. I cannot. I used to think it was just an occasional fetish for these people. I've come to realize that many of them have NOTHING else in their lives and are tremendously unhappy. Many have told me as much.

I am also still attempting to help any lurker tired enough of their pathetic existance and wanting to make a change. Life hurts, pain abounds, challenges are everywhere, and if you hide in dysfunctional pathetic twisted perversions, you will never find the happiness that was eluding you already when you first started your downward spiral. "Stand up strong, feel the pain, when the angels sing..."

Now, is that mean spirited? No.

BTW, I know several people who've come back to me over a year after I last heard from them who then tell me they made a clean break from the codependent nightmare of ignorant furry tolerance and have a new life and happiness. As long as I've reached one former spooge wanking fursuit spooging cretin, I've done a good thing.

No, names will not be named. I am once again trying to help and I'm not going to take part in one of the fandom's many pasttimes, humiliating others personally. That schoolyard group mentality is not a help, it's a hindrance. Do a search on Nekobe. I promised him I'd not tell anyone outside of close friends anything about his time living at my home and stayed totally away from the witch hunt against him. I won't help people get gang stomped.
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DA
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Joined: 06 Jun 2003
Posts: 320

Posted: 10/12/2003 12:44:10 AM     Post subject:  

Nekobe? oddly enough I was just reading the site on him...

So Wayd wolf, where do you now stand on furry? Still into Anthro's or about to give up on the whole sorry mess of the fetishist's who are taking over the fandom?
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