Crush...Yiff...Destroy!

Anonymous · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 767

Why not cover why someone with such talent continues to spend his time drawing herms, despite his protestations that he doesn't like them?

mouse · Coadjutor Joined: 13 Jul 2003 Posts: 662

why does ANYONE for that matter

i havent seen any hermaphrodite furry art, because i avoid the hell out of stuff like that , but i can imagine (and thats bad enough)

now far as i understand real-life hermaphrodites ..YEAH, they DO have both organs...BARELY
usually neither works, and they have all kinds of hormonal imbalance problems to deal with the rest of thier lives

i always hear people joking around about furry herm pictures, but is there actually a lot of this? and part 2 , is this one of those things some furrys get themselves into and give themselves some sort of sexual complex over

(im thinking along the same lines as whoever commented about furries not being able to draw naken women right cuz theyve never seen them - drawing what they think hermaphrodites are in thier own twisted world view)

Jerry Collins · Coadjutor Joined: 16 Jul 2003 Posts: 162

I'm not as literate as I wish to be,but,as to a "real" herm. it's very rare that the genitailia function properly as our colleague has said..I think it's a matter of "porn" realityv.s. "real" reality..in real reality a poor herm has a miserable existance,alienation,constant medical needs...in porn reality ,the herm. is a sexgod/godess(like in Michael Manning's "SPIDER'S GARDEN"and"HYDRODYPHIAN" for instance.) a living sex toy for either gender..but porn reality is not real reality!Doms don't go stomping about in their leathers and rubber 24/7!Lady cops will not give you a blowjob for parking leagally,tedi clad wood nymphs do not fall out of shrubs a the drop of a hat!it doesn't work that way!Sorry! Doug is a skilled draughtsman and illustrator..but,if he thinks he can make a living off his she-male horse girls..He's kidding himself!Me ,I do these crazy space warrior Deer people,it ain't made me rich,but I'm not the poorer for it! All I can do is wish Doug good luck,and hope he has a back-up when the rent's due!And God help us all when it comes to the rent monster!(Jerry)

Anonymous · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 767

why does ANYONE for that matter

i havent seen any hermaphrodite furry art, because i avoid the hell out of stuff like that , but i can imagine (and thats bad enough)

now far as i understand real-life hermaphrodites ..YEAH, they DO have both organs...BARELY
usually neither works, and they have all kinds of hormonal imbalance problems to deal with the rest of thier lives

i always hear people joking around about furry herm pictures, but is there actually a lot of this? and part 2 , is this one of those things some furrys get themselves into and give themselves some sort of sexual complex over

(im thinking along the same lines as whoever commented about furries not being able to draw naken women right cuz theyve never seen them - drawing what they think hermaphrodites are in thier own twisted world view)

Unfortunatly, there are probably more herms on furry muck then there have been in the history of the world. I honestly think it's because they want to have it both ways, not because of any realy desire to play a herm. And don't get me started on those STUPID pronouns.

Jerry Collins · Coadjutor Joined: 16 Jul 2003 Posts: 162

Your probably right about "THEM" wanting it both ways(no disrespect to anyone bi-sexual,it's just typical phurri nonsense it seems)or one thing Iv'e noticed,some of the ditzier phurries goe through these mass obsessions,,one month it's Rhino dominatrixes,next month Giraffe girls giving blow jobs,then after that she-male Horse women,then Otter girls is speedo mailots,bunny girls in japanese school girl uniforms,rubber Pony girls,Peacocks in bustiers,Seal girls in diving gear,She-Wolves in vinyl nun's habits.etc.etc.etc.so if it's a sencere longing to be a she-male fuzzyMs.Thang or a gooney fad,or cheap thrills, It won't matter a fig what I think,people will do what people will do,for ill or better.me? I'm just a crazy old man!..blessed be all here.(Jer)

Jerry Collins · Coadjutor Joined: 16 Jul 2003 Posts: 162

MY APPOLOGIES FOR MY VERY CRAPPY TYPING!I just looked at what I wrote..GAWD! my typing sucks!

Computolio · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 349

Doug Winger wouldn't make a very good article subject simply because the ONLY thing out of whack about him is what he draws; the rest of him is sane. I guess a Winger article could really be an exploration about the growing dickgirl (I don't call them hermaphodites because they aren't) infestation terrorizing the cartoon porn world, but that would quickly get really fucked up in an unfunny sort of way and difficult to research. Oh, and did i mention FREUDIAN+++++++?

All I know for now is that the primary influence behind this spread probably comes from Japan. Hentai is rife with this sort of stuff; in fact a better place to ask might be Ecchi-Attack.

If I could explain the dickgirl phenomenon, I would. If I could explain Doug Winger, I would. But I can't and I really don't want to.

-duncan

Jerry Collins · Coadjutor Joined: 16 Jul 2003 Posts: 162

..good point

Anonymous · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 767

Doug Winger wouldn't make a very good article subject simply because the ONLY thing out of whack about him is what he draws; the rest of him is sane. I guess a Winger article could really be an exploration about the growing dickgirl (I don't call them hermaphodites because they aren't) infestation terrorizing the cartoon porn world, but that would quickly get really fucked up in an unfunny sort of way and difficult to research. Oh, and did i mention FREUDIAN+++++++?

All I know for now is that the primary influence behind this spread probably comes from Japan. Hentai is rife with this sort of stuff; in fact a better palce to ask might be Ecchi-Attack.

If I could explain the dickgirl phenomenon, I would. If I could explain Doug Winger, I would. But I can't and I really don't want to.

-duncan

Fair enough. The only reason why I called them herms is because dickgirls is kind of crude.

Computolio · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 349

Fair enough. The only reason why I called them herms is because dickgirls is kind of crude.

Crude?!? We're talking about some mutated porn horror beasts with a genuinely confusing, totally alien and outright menally disturbed combination of penis+boobs and you're worried about sounding crude?

See, this is one of those furry things I will NEVER UNDERSTAND FULLY. That being that they don't swear much, even when standing within the center of a jizz-splattered furry clusterfuck. OH HEY I JUST SWORE WOW BETTER TELL THE TEACHER

-duncan

verix · Recusant Joined: 27 Jun 2003 Posts: 17

Crude?!? We're talking about some mutated porn horror beasts with a genuinely confusing, totally alien and outright menally disturbed combination of penis+boobs and you're worried about sounding crude?

See, this is one of those furry things I will NEVER UNDERSTAND FULLY. That being that they don't swear much, even when standing within the center of a jizz-splattered furry clusterfuck. OH HEY I JUST SWORE WOW BETTER TELL THE TEACHER

-duncan

Furries don't understand it either, let me tell you. Ask an average furry about Doug Winger, and they'll say "that's disgusting. Doug Winger makes the rest of the furries look insane." Which isn't true, because most furries are insane to begin with. Anyway, if you ask me, a very un-average furry, I find his artwork hilarious, just because it's so fucking off-the-wall. And I think Winger does it because it's so fucking weird. Personally, I think his artwork is just there to make fun of everyone: the macro artists, the hermaphrodite artists, etc. It's probably mockery, from my understanding. You look at the first group of artwork that he uploaded to VCL in like... 1994 or some shit like that... it doesn't look to be a joke or anything, I'm sure. But look now. Every single piece of art is attached with some sort of "witty" catchphrase, and contains some sort of "funny" anecdote. Personally, I think Doug Winger is just making a huge fucking joke out of his artwork, and isn't trying to make anything erotic out of it.

I think someone better to ask about this is Steve Martin, since he lives with Winger. Next time I see him, I'll ask what Winger draws that stuff for, if he even knows. Hell, I'll ask the guy myself if I have to. I worship Doug Winger in an idle, morbid way. I love his artwork. Just not in that "OMG THAT IS SO HOT-- A DOG WITH TWO PENISES AND A DRAGONHEAD" way.

Also, here's a fun fact: For every 10 pictures Winger uploads to his VCL account, he draws about 300. Mother fucker is a machine.

Jerry Collins · Coadjutor Joined: 16 Jul 2003 Posts: 162

well said,well said....From what little I know about Doug,he's reputably a fairly nice guy,plesant to be around,self effacing,an excellent sense of humour about himself...now,if there ever was a subject for a "no-mercy" article..Steven A. Martin would be a far richer target! mean,corrupt,sneaky,creepy..a far better choice than poor old Doug!(he likes she-male pony/horse girls..i.e..Doug,Me.....I do warrior Deer women in rubber) Doug ain't hurting anyone..unlike Eric,Steve Martin,or Brian O'Connell,..he just likes kinky mutant equine-gals,harmless wierdness...nothing more.God bless the lad.and good luck to him! as to Steve..what are you guys waiting for?start researching and writing!(jer)

mouse · Coadjutor Joined: 13 Jul 2003 Posts: 662

Furries don't understand it either, let me tell you. Ask an average furry about Doug Winger, and they'll say "that's disgusting. Doug Winger makes the rest of the furries look insane." Which isn't true, because most furries are insane to begin with. Anyway, if you ask me, a very un-average furry, I find his artwork hilarious, just because it's so fucking off-the-wall. And I think Winger does it because it's so fucking weird. Personally, I think his artwork is just there to make fun of everyone: the macro artists, the hermaphrodite artists, etc. It's probably mockery, from my understanding. You look at the first group of artwork that he uploaded to VCL in like... 1994 or some shit like that... it doesn't look to be a joke or anything, I'm sure. But look now. Every single piece of art is attached with some sort of "witty" catchphrase, and contains some sort of "funny" anecdote. Personally, I think Doug Winger is just making a huge fucking joke out of his artwork, and isn't trying to make anything erotic out of it.

I think someone better to ask about this is Steve Martin, since he lives with Winger. Next time I see him, I'll ask what Winger draws that stuff for, if he even knows. Hell, I'll ask the guy myself if I have to. I worship Doug Winger in an idle, morbid way. I love his artwork. Just not in that "OMG THAT IS SO HOT-- A DOG WITH TWO PENISES AND A DRAGONHEAD" way.

Also, here's a fun fact: For every 10 pictures Winger uploads to his VCL account, he draws about 300. Mother fucker is a machine.

i think thats a really good point
what the artist's intent for the piece is a very important aspect
theres a huge difference between a guy drawing cartoon animals for cartoon animal fans to jerk off to, and a guy who draws trademarked well known cartoon characters into a pornographic scene strictly for the purpose of being lewd/shocking etc (this is the type of thing you would see in an underground newspaper or soemthign liek that...real vicious nasty satire)

my take on genus when i read it was that its just more stuff in the genre, just adult/sexual humor

things only get creepy when you realize that people take it very seriously

take a look at that article where rick castro had some sort of art show (it was all furry stuff) at some richie place. people werent really that horrified they just thought it was kind of weird, mainyl cuz they didnt have all the background information that most peopel here, and rick castro has

thats what i got from it anyway

heres a link
http://www.laweekly.com/ink/02/16/slush.php

mouse · Coadjutor Joined: 13 Jul 2003 Posts: 662

speaking of mutant porn and harmless weirdness

sometimes i wonder why subgenius hasnt crept into furry and vice versa...oh wait nevermind, i knwo why, subgenius fucking knows better

still i cant help but think that "furry" might have been saved with subgenius intervention and assimilation

i dunno when subgenius started so who knows if it would have even been possible

Computolio · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 349

(he likes she-male pony/horse girls..i.e..Doug,Me.....I do warrior Deer women in rubber)

That's pretty fucking scary and weird right there.

-duncan

Jerry Collins · Coadjutor Joined: 16 Jul 2003 Posts: 162

Anonymous · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 767

Fair enough. The only reason why I called them herms is because dickgirls is kind of crude.

Crude?!? We're talking about some mutated porn horror beasts with a genuinely confusing, totally alien and outright menally disturbed combination of penis+boobs and you're worried about sounding crude?

See, this is one of those furry things I will NEVER UNDERSTAND FULLY. That being that they don't swear much, even when standing within the center of a jizz-splattered furry clusterfuck. OH HEY I JUST SWORE WOW BETTER TELL THE TEACHER

-duncan

Well, I'm no furry, I just don't like using crude words. It's just not my style, that's all.

mouse · Coadjutor Joined: 13 Jul 2003 Posts: 662

computolio, im not contesting your explanation, but i would liek some clarification:

doug winger is sane, but only what he draws is insane, then you say you wouldnt want to explain doug winger

huh?

btw, i hope u dont mind
i ever start a band, wind up in a band, or am asked to suggest a band name..

it will be
The Mutated Porn Horror Beasts

in fact i like the term so much it almost legitimized whatever this threads about ...it makes me not care

mouse · Coadjutor Joined: 13 Jul 2003 Posts: 662

same goes for jizz-spattered furry clusterfuck
(yes i changed splattered to spattered, it sounds better)

Jerry Collins · Coadjutor Joined: 16 Jul 2003 Posts: 162

I'll buy your first c.d.!

Anonymous · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 767

hey jerry theres some guy from your past looking for you

email me

mouse@blackvault.com

The New Meat · Coadjutor Joined: 03 Jun 2003 Posts: 327

We're not talking about the same Steve Martin, are we?

Mitch · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 290

Erm, not the same Steve Martin who starred in "The Jerk" and "The Man With Two Brains" in case that's what you were thinking.

There's some small thumbs of his art here: http://www.digital-imp.com/products/special/steve.html if you're curious.

Jerry Collins · Coadjutor Joined: 16 Jul 2003 Posts: 162

Mitch:Oh ,no,uh,Not the actor/comedian....The Steve I'm talking about is a kinda scary lil'dude..He occasionally has outbreaks of Frankburnsitits and the Rabid Feringi syndrome..coarse,a tad sexist,obsessive,mildly creepy to profoundly annoying, more than a bit clueless and tactless(do your self a favour,never confide in the loopy lil' bugger,Steve is also,sadly,infected with Diarreah of the mouth and a bit of a gossip-monger).If evil,it's more of an ex-roommate evil than a Hitler evil..(sorry if I blew it out of contex or size "a-la- Newt" folks). However ,to be fair,he is an EXCELLENT draughtsman and renderer (his anatomy is a bit skewed,and his character's faces have a vapid,lifelessness to them,rather DEAD in the eyes as the saying goes).And you can't say the little devil doesn't have an imagination,his stuff's cliche' ridden,but at least fairly (not by much)...original. He can be a bit hackneyed and corner-cuttingish,but ,at least the little shmo has a far better work ethic than Brian O'Connell....and also unlike Brian,Steve bathes!(rather fussy and vain and if he has the budget,a bit of the "sporty/casual" dandy).Steve is creepy and scary, a bit skewded in the moral compass department...BUT....compaired to a lot of the phurries, a LOT closer to a human being.In years past ,Steve, shall we say ,did not endear himself to me(i.e. his aggravating personality,questionable bussiness deals far too convoluted even for the Medicis...I still can't figure out his motives or how he does whatever he does!...obnoxious behaviour,snide comments second hand ..wish I had exact quotes.)...and on and on.odd lil' bugger.

verix · Recusant Joined: 27 Jun 2003 Posts: 17

Since now this conversation shifted from Winger to Martin, I'll add in my tidbits of fun:

From my understanding, Martin really likes porn. The very first thing he said to me was, quote, "LOOK AT MY SPOOGE ART!"

He's also kind of bitter. He was sitting in a booth right next to Max Blackrabbit and kept complaining about how Blackrabbit was doing better with sales than he was, and was able to draw faster and better than him, etc. Well back in my day, we didn't have this confangled "Photoshop" gizmo...

Also, another fun fact: I met SqueeRat in person and never realized it. She's no longer some stupid bitch set to piss off the entire fucking fandom. Though she does still have gripes about a lot of it.

Computolio · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 349

Also, another fun fact: I met SqueeRat in person and never realized it. She's no longer some stupid bitch set to piss off the entire fucking fandom. Though she does still have gripes about a lot of it.

How does "pissing off the entire fucking fandom" make one a bitch? It is an admirable and hilarious activity. (SEE: THIS SITE.)

Regarding "SqueeRat", she's long since changed aliases and has been busy cutting any sort of ties to and associations with furrydumb for years now. She considers her association with furrydumb to have been one of the greatest mistakes of her life. Like thousands of other now-former furries, she arrived on the scene not knowing the whole story, having only a platonic interest in anthropomorphic character design/cartooning. As she learned more and more about who and what was really driving the show, she became more and more horrified.

The Burned Fur thing was basically her reaction to what she encountered. Thinking the problems she saw were fixable, she got herself in an even deeper mess. What happened during the Burned Fur incidents gave her a rude awakening. She saw the folly of focusing on animal characters excessively, how drawing them was not a true test of artistic skill, how it all could lead to disaster. Indeed, anthropomorphic animals are not an art form but an artistic device - one she has vowed never to use again thanks to her experiences.

She's been trying to break into the comics industry, always improving and coming up with some genuinely hilarious stuff. It'll be a long time before we know if she's made it yet, but when she does it will be a teriffic turnaround story. Perhaps one that could inspire at least a select few those naive teenagers on Elfwood/Yerf/whatever to stop drawing wolfman crap and learn to tackle something far more rewarding and creative..

-duncan

verix · Recusant Joined: 27 Jun 2003 Posts: 17

How does "pissing off the entire fucking fandom" make one a bitch? It is an admirable and hilarious activity. (SEE: THIS SITE.)

"Bitch" isn't exactly always a negative term (at least with me). You and Mitch are bitches (or to be gender specific: assholes) for making this site and making fun (and telling the truth) of fandom. But you're making it funny (and you're telling the truth), which is why I don't mind, I laugh, and read the site every time a new article comes out. Hell, I'm an asshole too, and I'm not afraid to admit it. But if you're bitter, and fucking hate everything, then you're not a good bitch or asshole. (EDIT: I suck at answering questions. You are a bitch/asshole if you poke fun, make fun, or tell the truth about something.)

This site, and SqueeRat, are good bitches/assholes. In my eyes, anyway.

EDIT: I actually like her manifesto on fandom, really. It tells the truth. It classifies each and every furry there is. It also cracks me up that every furry raises their "paws" in defense and goes "HEY YOU BITCH THAT'S VERY NOT NICE WHY WOULD YOU POST THIS AND SAY EVERYONE IS LIKE THIS," when it's obvious she's just classifying everyone.

mouse · Coadjutor Joined: 13 Jul 2003 Posts: 662

having only a platonic interest in anthropomorphic character design/cartooning. As she learned more and more about who and what was really driving the show, she became more and more horrified.

i dont see what the prob is here , same thign basically happened to me , but i didnt wig out....i wont say she was wrong, in fact the burned furs were a good idea (IMHO), but they made a bunch of mistakes from the get go. squee rat had no strategy no battleplan.
at this point in time i consider myself "waiting in the wings" for somethign to happen in the fandom....if it never does...fuck it , i dont care, i dont and never will need a fandom...

i have a near endless list of interests (in fact u may be surprised to learn that car kulture (LOTS of art here), hot rods, automotive work, old US cars are my #1 interest) that will keep me busy the rest of my life

But Furry COULD have been a fandom where the people who produce things (pro-semi-pro) are very close to the people who enjoy them (fans), and peopel could slowly move up from being just fans to professionals through APAs or whatever...furry made the worst mistake of its fucking life when it alienated the professionals....there is just not words to describe how fucking dumb this was. furry IS different from other fandoms, and NOT just the way everyone been bitching about it either

what i mean is this:

if you like star wars, great, you can write all the fanfiction you want, until lucas comes out wiht another movie, you have a very finite amount of material you like

"The Appreciation of Anthropomorphic Animals in Modern Culture" is a term someone used maybe mitch i cant remember....jesus christ, you could market somethign like that FOREVER

the idea is not flawed, for one reason or another , god only knows why, it attracted unstable people. and it just SNOWBALLED
if someone , everyone, had put thier foot down when they should have
NONE OF THIS WOULD HAVE HAPPENED

Naivety has got to be the WORST flaw of furries. plaina nd simple they have no fucking street smarts.. at all

She saw the folly of focusing on animal characters excessively, how drawing them was not a true test of artistic skill, how it all could lead to disaster.

I dont see how it would be or wouldnt be. is photorealistic true artistic skill? some people have made the point that with the advent of cameras there is less purpose to drawing in this fashion ..i think the question is bogus to begin with.

and as i stated earlier, i really dont feel it had to lead to disaster...if a few people had stayed and started kicking ass instead of running away who knows, this website wouldnt exist

wouldnt it be nice that if those interested in cartooning, animation, specifically - although maybe not in the long run - with animals , furry was more like community or a guild....you could go to, talk wiht people and learn something there? its probably the only fandom in the world that could exist in that fashion. it thrives on and promotes art by the people in it....i have never seen anythign like that

basically its my feeling that people had discovered something special and flushed it down the toilet

smooth

Indeed, anthropomorphic animals are not an art form but an artistic device - one she has vowed never to use again thanks to her experiences.

id like some clarification on art form vs art device

as for her never drawing an animal...that just seems stupid. her past is always gonna be there, whats to be ashamed of....especially in her case? its true that you are who you associate with , but what? she cant defend herself, or doesnt have enough good qualities to get by without desperatly trying to hide something she was involved in (cartooning animals?!?!)

She's been trying to break into the comics industry, always improving and coming up with some genuinely hilarious stuff. It'll be a long time before we know if she's made it yet, but when she does it will be a teriffic turnaround story. Perhaps one that could inspire at least a select few those naive teenagers on Elfwood/Yerf/whatever to stop drawing wolfman crap and learn to tackle something far more rewarding and creative..

-duncan

whoa...usually people who are interested in drawing this stuff are the people who draw it professionally. disney animators , etc. and theres numerous cases to prove this

mike kazalah been in the industry since the 60s, and from the looks of things he can do whatever he wants.

hamill - disney*

stan jinx and cindy crowell both worked at WB*

*(this is just what i gathered, i dont know for a fact)

lot of furries are art students..more likely than not, theyll end up in the field in some capacity

if i come off sounding hostile toward YOU im not trying to

but i really disagree with what your saying here

mouse · Coadjutor Joined: 13 Jul 2003 Posts: 662

ALSO:

im gettign the impression, and i touched on this before

seems that you guys bitch about stuff liek intenet furry porn, VCL, yerf, MUCKS etc

no one makes money off of any of this shit except for the guy with the pay-porn website. its mostly invisible except to internet nerds like @ PoE and SA

there is a business aspect to all of this , comic books
like em or not, furry comics are in diamond dist. catalogs
and due to small print runs , alot of this shit is gonna be goddamn rare as hell

AND i think youll start seeing more of it in the future - Cartoons
internet based ones

dave kelly, has kind of started on this, i know PurplePussy had a flash music video, he conscripted some band to do a short song
and then made the animation for it

so your seeign an expansion in some ways

also check out the webcomics coz/effect and battlegate
far as i know that guys a furry, and he might be getting those comics turned into a cartoon...very high quality stuff, hes involved in some sort of contest

there was a thread on A.F.F. about it i think its called "a very special appeal to the furry fandom" or something to that effect , to get people to go vote for this guy

im goin to sleep so i cant get a link right this second maybe tomarrow sometime ...but it was within the past month . and it spawned a bunch of other threads too .

mouse · Coadjutor Joined: 13 Jul 2003 Posts: 662

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&safe=off&threadm=5c6a3f88.0307071842.28e0377d%40posting.google.com&rnum=1&prev=/groups%3Fq%3Da%2Bspecial%2Bappeal%2Bgroup:alt.fan.furry.*%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26group%3Dalt.fan.furry.*%26safe%3Doff%26selm%3D5c6a3f88.0307071842.28e0377d%2540posting.google.com%26rnum%3D1
this is the main thread

http://groups.google.com/groups?dq=&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&safe=off&threadm=Pine.OSF.4.33.0307162236370.1417-100000%40worf.netins.net&prev=/groups%3Fdq%3D%26num%3D25%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26group%3Dalt.fan.furry%26safe%3Doff%26start%3D25
this is after the contest ended

http://groups.google.com/groups?q=a+special+appeal+group:alt.fan.furry.*&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&group=alt.fan.furry.*&safe=off&selm=be0494%24mm1%241%40tiger.chameleon.net&rnum=2
this was off on its own for whatever reason

also take a look at these:

http://herbietoons.com/
http://herbietoons.com/index.php3?cat=ANIMATION|page=DayDreamer
thats a cartoon looks liek he did it all by himself , his page might say right on it that he works at disney but his style looks like he does

http://www.radiocomix.com/filthyanimalscatalog.html
filthy animals - i cant rememebr where it said they used to be at WB but
it even looks like WB characters (i have all 3 of these comics)

which id like to comment, i can imagine how repeatitive animating is
and i am sure that why studios specifically have a "feel" to them
even long after the original guy is dead everythign produced has the same look and feel to it, it probably get ingrained into these artists and it shows in everythign they do (kazalehs stuff always makes me think of 1960's america when i look at it...not that i was around for 1960s america...)

when they did roger rabbit, they specically went for tex averys humor, disneys look and WBs characters...altho to me roger rabbit was near 100% tex avery ..which is why it was such an awsome movie (i still laugh uncontrollably when i see the cartoon cab jump in and start driving the car ...a cartoon car - driving a car (!!)

ps.
i think shawn keller is disney too

please correct me on any factual errors here

Computolio · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 349

My story of um.. the person formerly known as "SqueeRat"'s experiences basically reflects not only her opinion on the issue, but mine as well. I see no way for it to change; the bad put out by furrydumb outweighs the good to such an astronomical degree that it really and truly has no hope and perhaps never had any hope.

The. Fucking. End.

-duncan

mouse · Coadjutor Joined: 13 Jul 2003 Posts: 662

I see no way for it to change; the bad put out by furrydumb outweighs the good to such an astronomical degree that it really and truly has no hope and perhaps never had any hope.

step back to 1986 and look what was going on anthropomorphics were all over the place - things werent that bad
look at skunk (90? 91?) and the stuff they are commenting on is legitimate, but mild

fans are what fucked it up..if the ideas fine but the people are the problem...get rid of the people

and sure theres hope

i loan out my stuff all the time to my friends
im just a funny-animal fan far as anyone is concerned(which is actually more truthful than if i said i was a furry)im only interested in funny animal comics (mostly)

funny animal comics go back to the 30s , theyll always exist
so long after fury implodes on itself like i get the feeling and for the most part hope it will

the genre will still be around

i may very well just retreat to the regular comic fandom and promote funny animal comics there as opposed to all the other garbage (superheros)

(altho capt carrot / atomic mouse etc...AOK by me)

what you have to undestand is when something is put into print, it gives it at least some sort of legitimacy, i dont knwo if you can understand that or not

i dont think any comic shop in the world woudl have any qualms at all about stocking (hoarding) even a gay furry porn comic like associated student bodies, knowing the value would launch 2000% in 3 years
(i saw an all 8 issues set of ASB go for auction @ $500.. it was unreal) that was an exception but its still heavily traded among furries from what i can see

is it just furry lust for a comic that had a small print run..yes

but theres other examples
albedo #2 is $100 usually , $125 for 1st and 2nd printings of #0 (althought realistically the 50 print run ont he 1st prn is SO RARE you can get a hell of a lot more i would imagine), $50 for #1
criters #1 $50 (these are just ballpark #s)

that aint bad at all , for comics that originally defined the fandom
some of it you cant ignore

(works for me i bought critters #1 for $5 nm/m cond , AND got spooky the dog catcher -some kids comic AUTOGRAPHED for $2.50 also nm/m, both from a small shop over the internet....$12/w shipping for well over $75 worth of books , thanks guys)

Donna Barr is still selling SKUNK
www.stinz.com

so is mu press
http://mupress.com

in case your interested

Jerry Collins · Coadjutor Joined: 16 Jul 2003 Posts: 162

(He shoots...HE SCORES!GOOOOOOOOOOOAAAAAALLL!!!!!!)
Well done brother Mouse!

mouse · Coadjutor Joined: 13 Jul 2003 Posts: 662

hey whattaya know

in 8 hours yet another set of ASB going for a ridiculously high price

$325 and they havent even met the reserve yet :

Complete set of ASB comics

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Information
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Complete set of ASB comics View comments on this item (0) Track This Item!
Category: Comics, Zines and non-original Books - R-rated to NC-17 (Adult bidders only)
Offered By: Jtbear (8)
Send e-mail View other auctions
Current Time: Thu Jul 24 04:44:10 2003 (Eastern)
Closes: Thu Jul 24 13:24:36 2003
Or 10 minutes after last bid...
Closes in: 08 hours 40 minutes
Number of Bids: 10
Current High Bidder: Paintedtiger (0) Send e-mail
Last Bid: $325 (reserve price not yet met) Bid!

just some info

this comic looks like it originally sold for $3.50

rabbit valley (they MADE the comic) are selling #7 for $50 each cuz they have 2 left

i already stated why i think this is happening (not that its hard to figure), but id just point this out ...i guess that set that sold for $500 aint that far off from normal after all..

Jerry Collins · Coadjutor Joined: 16 Jul 2003 Posts: 162

Mouse ! what an insainly good bit of luck!isn't it a sweet thing folks when you can find a goodie dirt cheap?Yes sir it is!( like buying a rare old car for the price of a 2nd hand mountain bike) I love it when this happens!....Does anybody else have a similar experience?(Jer)

Anonymous · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 767

I'm going to have to agree with earlier posts and say Steve Martin is a major candidate for researching. I personally have had some dealings with the man and my girlfriend had experiences working with him. She thought he was some ok dude but also told me about things he said regarding his fantasies about HER and etc. She had some business, I forget what, but I drove her to steve martin's house and that evening, other than the usual doug winger, his guests were robert guthrie and kevin duane! I was really wary at the time, thinking Martin was some old loser trying to mack on my girl, and then later I heard other women tell us stories about how effed up Steve was and how he acted around furry fan females, etc. I used to worship that guy back in 94-95, I mean, look at how good his artwork is. But as far as I'm concerned, he is a perverted old man with nothing better to do but jack off to babs bunny, and what a screw up. Soon after we visit, reportedly a friend spoke to him and told us he was depressed about her having a boyfriend. I don't know about you all, but hearing about an old screw up like that fantasizing about your girlfriend while she is there several times trying to be friendly, that is insane. I'd boot that guy one if he'd tried anything, but he seems to be an old wussy loser anyway.

Kevin Duane obviously is another one, but most of furrydom doesn't like him anyway, so there's almost no point.

Jerry Collins · Coadjutor Joined: 16 Jul 2003 Posts: 162

I knew Martin was a sexist drip,BUT JAYYYZUZZ!If that putz tried that on one of our local fans,he'd be cat fish fodder!And if he was stupid enough to pull that nonsense on my wife Becky,my wife would have a new fuzzy coin pouch!(and that would be IF she was in a GOOD mood!)How gratifying to me to hear somebody else tell a "STEVE-O" story,to throw back into the faces of the sheep-like ninnies that adorise him the old"Your'e- just- being- jealous -Jerry,-Steve- is- a -great guy" bollox!I feel redeemed,validated now.Now I can can say in good consious my feelings again!And not be censured by the innocently ignorant!thank you who-ever you are for your story about Steve!Thank you for your frankness and courage.Stand tall Kinsman!Stand tall!(Jerry)

mouse · Coadjutor Joined: 13 Jul 2003 Posts: 662

http://www.furbid.ws/cgi-bin/auction.pl?fur_comic_r

i deleted the names in this post because
1- it doesnt matter,
2- it struck me that it might be in poor taste, particularly since this post will be around longer than the link. im only pointing out the overkill here

obviously that link above will be worthless sometime after 8/7/03
but if you go there before youll see the auction this post refers to

All 8 ASB Issues, Signed. Portfolios

I am selling off my collection of Associated Student Bodies. Included are the first 8 issues, each signed by Numerous artists of the series. The first and last issues are signed by Chris and Lance. Also I am including several of the portfolio's and one of the calendars.

Bid History
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
START:
(Thu Jul 24 13:54:22 2003) - $50
(Thu Jul 24 16:02:27 2003) - $50.00
(Sat Jul 26 01:18:33 2003) - $100.00
(Sat Jul 26 03:11:33 2003) - $200.00
(Wed Jul 30 18:40:02 2003) - $1500

motherfucking fifteen hundred dollars??!?!

i dunno if this dude is fucking around or not,
its not a proxy bidding auction, if this is for real - either he didnt know that and just wanted to set his max bid real high, or just wanted to blow everyone the fuck out of the water with this H-bomb bid

Computolio · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 349

motherfucking fifteen hundred dollars??!?!

BAAAAAAAAAA HAHAHAHAHAHA

I can't BELIEVE someone would put such a high value on a comic so shitty. It's as if the "comics as commodity" mindset of the mainstream merged with the abysmal standards of furrydumb to create a black hole of raw cash.

A furry and his money are soon parted, it appears.

Anonymous · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 767

One again: WinMX.
You can get all of the issues plus the portfolios from WinMX for free if you have enough patience.

mouse · Coadjutor Joined: 13 Jul 2003 Posts: 662

well i guess for people who really want to read it and instead of shelling out tons of cash for it

my main point was to show how much the value (apperently) of the physical comic has increased in basically such a short time since it was produced

Chris Baird · Coadjutor Joined: 04 Aug 2003 Posts: 78

Back to the Doug subject again...

While we're largely in agreement about his 'sane guy drawing insane but funny freaky shit', there's still the issue that DW is the primary historical influence for all the fuck-ups out there.

Just about every 'kink' out there only became popular after Doug popularised them with the free uploaded art. Certainly, Macros, Vore, Inflatibles, extreme sexual fetish, etc., had been around prior in the works of Ken Sample and friends, but the great unwashed fandom never saw any of it. When did the Herm population explosion occur on FurryMUCK/Tapestries/Velar? Immediately after Doug started uploading drawings of the then-few roleplayers...

(On an aside, "starkitt.gif", the first picture of his I saw back in 1993, really looks strange today on a high-quality LCD monitor...)

Anonymous · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 767

http://www.furbid.ws/cgi-bin/auction.pl?fur_comic_r

i deleted the names in this post because
1- it doesnt matter,
2- it struck me that it might be in poor taste, particularly since this post will be around longer than the link. im only pointing out the overkill here

obviously that link above will be worthless sometime after 8/7/03
but if you go there before youll see the auction this post refers to

All 8 ASB Issues, Signed. Portfolios

I am selling off my collection of Associated Student Bodies. Included are the first 8 issues, each signed by Numerous artists of the series. The first and last issues are signed by Chris and Lance. Also I am including several of the portfolio's and one of the calendars.

Bid History
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
START:
(Thu Jul 24 13:54:22 2003) - $50
(Thu Jul 24 16:02:27 2003) - $50.00
(Sat Jul 26 01:18:33 2003) - $100.00
(Sat Jul 26 03:11:33 2003) - $200.00
(Wed Jul 30 18:40:02 2003) - $1500

motherfucking fifteen hundred dollars??!?!

i dunno if this dude is fucking around or not,
its not a proxy bidding auction, if this is for real - either he didnt know that and just wanted to set his max bid real high, or just wanted to blow everyone the fuck out of the water with this H-bomb bid

To my eternal shame, I got a copy of Associated student bodies, because everyone told me it was great.

It was not.

I’m auctioning my Copy in the desperate hope of getting some money so that I can complete my obsession with “Emperor Of The Fading Suns”, by getting a boxed copy of the computer game version of it. (which came out in 1996!!!?!?!)

However, Let no one say, I have not warned any prospective buyer about how rubbish the comic is :o)

It will be interesting to see if it sells…

Anonymous · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 767

http://www.furbid.ws/cgi-bin/auction.pl?fur_comic_r

i deleted the names in this post because
1- it doesnt matter,
2- it struck me that it might be in poor taste, particularly since this post will be around longer than the link. im only pointing out the overkill here

obviously that link above will be worthless sometime after 8/7/03
but if you go there before youll see the auction this post refers to

All 8 ASB Issues, Signed. Portfolios

I am selling off my collection of Associated Student Bodies. Included are the first 8 issues, each signed by Numerous artists of the series. The first and last issues are signed by Chris and Lance. Also I am including several of the portfolio's and one of the calendars.

Bid History
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
START:
(Thu Jul 24 13:54:22 2003) - $50
(Thu Jul 24 16:02:27 2003) - $50.00
(Sat Jul 26 01:18:33 2003) - $100.00
(Sat Jul 26 03:11:33 2003) - $200.00
(Wed Jul 30 18:40:02 2003) - $1500

motherfucking fifteen hundred dollars??!?!

i dunno if this dude is fucking around or not,
its not a proxy bidding auction, if this is for real - either he didnt know that and just wanted to set his max bid real high, or just wanted to blow everyone the fuck out of the water with this H-bomb bid

To my eternal shame, I got a copy of Associated student bodies, because everyone told me it was great.

It was not.

I’m auctioning my Copy in the desperate hope of getting some money so that I can complete my obsession with “Emperor Of The Fading Suns”, by getting a boxed copy of the computer game version of it. (which came out in 1996!!!?!?!)

However, Let no one say, I have not warned any prospective buyer about how rubbish the comic is :o)

It will be interesting to see if it sells…

Thats, me what done it. A fool and his firebirds are easily parted when it comes to holistic games. :op

creature · Coadjutor Joined: 06 Nov 2003 Posts: 132

Doug only does it really to screw with people. He does a ton of stuff that isn't adult or freakish that he never posts.

creature · Coadjutor Joined: 06 Nov 2003 Posts: 132

well said,well said....From what little I know about Doug,he's reputably a fairly nice guy,plesant to be around,self effacing,an excellent sense of humour about himself...

Just don't offer him a smoke. I've seen smokers conventions with less lightups then him.

now,if there ever was a subject for a "no-mercy" article..Steven A. Martin would be a far richer target! mean,corrupt,sneaky,creepy..a far better choice than poor old Doug!

Ohgoddamnyes. Looks like a pervert. Acts like a pervert. Smells like a pervert. He is the ultimate example of a greedy bastard one trick pony.

(he likes she-male pony/horse girls..i.e..Doug,Me.....I do warrior Deer women in rubber) Doug ain't hurting anyone..unlike Eric,Steve Martin,or Brian O'Connell,..he just likes kinky mutant equine-gals,harmless wierdness...nothing more.God bless the lad.and good luck to him! as to Steve..what are you guys waiting for?start researching and writing!(jer)

Eric is just a walking copyright violation. BOC just fucks people over. Martin is just fucked up.

creature · Coadjutor Joined: 06 Nov 2003 Posts: 132

my take on genus when i read it was that its just more stuff in the genre, just adult/sexual humor

things only get creepy when you realize that people take it very seriously

Oh, you have no idea. I know at least three women in the furry fandom who have been dumped by guys because they would never be what they see in their dreams, some tall, six breasted female animal will to do whatever they wanted.

Sad fuckers.

Mitch · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Jun 2003 Posts: 290

Doug only does it really to screw with people. He does a ton of stuff that isn't adult or freakish that he never posts.

To be honest, that's what I always kind of thought.

creature · Coadjutor Joined: 06 Nov 2003 Posts: 132

To be honest, that's what I always kind of thought.

Talking with him the only reason he does half the stuff he does is to see how far he can go before he freaks out the freaks.

*morningstar · Recusant Joined: 03 Jul 2004 Posts: 5

my take on genus when i read it was that its just more stuff in the genre, just adult/sexual humor

things only get creepy when you realize that people take it very seriously

Oh, you have no idea. I know at least three women in the furry fandom who have been dumped by guys because they would never be what they see in their dreams, some tall, six breasted female animal will to do whatever they wanted.

Sad fuckers.

I know a very nice girl going through the same thing with hey "boyfriend" right now. She's not bad looking at all, but he's expressed to me (another girl) that he doesn't like this and this and this about her and that my looks are something that he's more accoustomed to. He keeps pestering me to draw him yiff and shit of his and his girlfriend's fursonas and I keep telling him no.

In a nutshell, he doesn't like the way she looks because she's not her fursona. He told me that he finds the human form unattractive because he's so used to looking at furries. That's fine in itself, whatever floats your boat. But then he's also killing the self esteem of this girl because he's making her feel bad about being a Homo sapien.

Sean · Recusant Joined: 05 Nov 2003 Posts: 16

I'm going to have to agree with earlier posts and say Steve Martin is a major candidate for researching.

May I interject my own (long-winded) experience with Steve?

Back in '99, the year of the disasterous ConFurence 10 in San Diego where Merlino jumped off the sinking ship mid-con, I was invited to stay awhile before and after the con at a respectable furry fan friend's place in Orange County. (He drove me to all kinds of places in the LA area with a near-instinctual road knowledge that would make a London cabbie look like a lost child by comparison. But I digress.) He'd been to Chez Martin before, and, as a special treat, he arranged to take me over there to meet him, check out his mad-scientist abode, and take us out for dinner at a nearby Claim Jumpers restaurant.

This is where I got a taste of the legendary Steve Martin tact (or lack thereof).

I forget just how the thread of conversation went as we sat in our restaurant booth, but I remember gently bringing up my medical conditions - hemophilia (a blood clotting disorder), with its associated joint arthritis, and the triple-whammy of having acquired HIV and hepatitis B and C from contaminated blood products used to treat my bleeding episodes. (Blessedly, I haven't had very many complications from these infections. I owe it all to God, good genes, and fairly clean living.)

Now, I don't actually bring these heavy personal things up very often or to many people, but I generally get supportive replies of "sorry to hear that; hope you stay well" or "hey, glad to see that they haven't caused you all that many problems; keep up the good fight, brah".

Steve? He looked at me and exclaimed, "Wow, man...you're fucked!"

Also, he brought a super-dirty coffee-table-sized sketchbook of his artwork to our table. The last half of the book was a endless parade of furry characters' rear ends and nethers being penetrated by dicks and/or phallic syringey devices to induce transsexual transformations. It both amazed and baffled me to think that he felt the need to practice this particular theme in such sheer volume...

(Addendum: I don't think I've ever eaten as much food at one sitting as I did at Claim Jumpers. My "lunch menu" hot turkey sandwich came with a giant, sweet, luscious corn muffin (no need to butter it!) and a tray stacked with roast turkey on some kind of exotic stuffing, all aswim in gravy, with a veritable trough of heavenly garlic mashed potatoes on the side, all garnished with an entire fucking Red Delicious apple and a forest of parsley. I was in a carb-stupor for the rest of the night.)

Paul · Coadjutor Joined: 01 Feb 2004 Posts: 138

In a nutshell, he doesn't like the way she looks because she's not her fursona. He told me that he finds the human form unattractive because he's so used to looking at furries. That's fine in itself, whatever floats your boat. But then he's also killing the self esteem of this girl because he's making her feel bad about being a Homo sapien.

Jeez. I hope this girl ditches him; nobody deserves to be steam-rolled like that. And if this guy does not apreciate her for what she is, he doesn't deserve that relationship.

It's a consolation that he, and the guys creature mentioned, probably won't ever breed.